What gas grade do you use!?

CO, 87 or 91 non ethanol only.

 

I favor 91 and usually from Costco. I found it tends to have slightly better throttle response vs 87 octane.

 

87 at Costco. If I can't fill up there, I'll add @ 5 gallons of top tier 87 somewhere else.

 

i also use costco and get 87

 

87 chevron, shell, Exxon in that order.
All “raw” gasoline is the same in the refinery.
Depending on the company it’s their “injection package” that distinguishes it at the pump ie shell, chevron, Exxon top tier down to convenience store un branded.

 

I always buy 91 octane when available, and get Shell, BP or Chevron gas, as they produce high quality gas with high quality additives for keeping the engine clean. Exxon is good as well. There are other brands of high quality gas, but in my area Shell, BP and Chevron are common. Some say you don't need an octane higher than 89 and that may be true. However, I have always used the higher octane and never had engine issues. I do know that in my BMW, any octane lower than 91 caused occasional delays in acceleration. That is because the lower octane is not optimal for a highly tuned performance engine. It all likelihood 89 octane in a 4R is completely fine and would not cause any long term issues. I just stick with my old habit of using 91 whenever I can. I would not recommend getting an octane lower than 89, as those levels of octane are not as highly refined and could cause buildup in your engine.

Here is a nice article by consumer reports that provides more insights on fuel choices.
https://www.consumerreports.org/car-maintenance/study-shows-top-tier-gasoline-worth-extra-price/

 

I watched the video , and he definitely says don’t use higher octane because it’s a complete waste of money. I wouldn’t anyway, but just wanted to point that out. I do agree with using top tier fuel, but not high octane.

 

72 degrees is optimum combustion temp., and moisture content/air pressure has a lot to do with it. Long story short, I use high test to gain every bit of HP I can, and to run more efficient...

 

87 octane from a top-tier station.

 

87. Usually from Kwik Trip stores in Arizona. Kwik Trip is top tier grade.

 

So what exactly does this mean? Marked in blue.

 

I believe they are the same rating 87 vs research number. So stick with 87 top tier is best

 

87. Top Tier unless I'm stuck someplace without the option. Unfortunately, I can't avoid ethanol around here.

Surprised no one has mentioned higher HP with higher octanes. Maybe it's not really true, but I thought I saw on this forum somewhere that Toyota itself says the 4runner develops a bit more power with premium gas.

 

Higher octane does not in any way shape or form equate to more HP. Engines are built and ECUs tuned to use certain octane fuel.
Higher octane fuel is less volatile than lower octanes. This makes it suitable to be used in high compression engines (high compression ratio or forced induction such as a turbo or supercharger). Higher octane fuel is less prone to pre-ignition. Using lower octane is high compression engine can damage it as the mixture can self-ignite from the compression alone - before the spark even ignited and in doing so cause damage to the engine.
Using higher octane fuel in lower compression engine will actually give you worse gas mileage and will produce less power.
SOME modern engines are designed to use sensors to essentially listen to the engine and adjust (advance) ignition timing. In such cases, having higher octane allows the ECU to push the timing sooner to increase power output. If knock or ping is sensed by the ECU the timing is then retarded.
Our vehicle’s ECU will not advance timing when higher octane fuel is used. And, being actually harder to burn - you engine will produce less power and yield lower gas mileage. Anyone telling otherwise is suffering from their butt-dyno experiencing a placebo effect.
What does affect gas mileage and power in our engines is the energy density of the fuel. Having ethanol or other additions in there decrease fuel density.
Some people intentionally run ethanol in their cars as it allows for the timing to be more advanced - but doe to lower energy density you end up with horrible gas mileage.

Short answer - our engine will not produce more of anything from higher octane fuel.

 

Good to know.

I found the older posts I'd remembered seeing. They're in this thread: https://www.4runners.com/threads/what-type-of-gas-do-you-use.13972/#post-155920

A couple people there assert that our engine advances timing and thus adds HP with higher octane.

It's certainly the case that HP drops with lower octane gas in many cars that recommend premium. I've had at least a few cars like that. Their loss of HP with lower octane was documented in their owners manuals.

But I have no clue about the impact of octane on HP in the 4Runner. Just remembered seeing the discussion linked above. If it's not true it's not true.

Regardless, I love being able to use regular gas. And my Runner has not seen a drop of anything else. Every other car I'd had for many, many years before the Runner either recommended or actually required premium!

 

I was hoping to maybe get a little better explanation. Research octane number 91 or higher kinda makes my head hurt.

 

Absolutely. Most modern vehicles will retard timing (resulting is less power/gas mileage) is knock sensors pick up undesirable harmonics. This is done to prevent detonation. But, reverse is not true for using higher than recommended octane rating. Engines ECU has to be calibrated to deliberately and constantly try to advance timing until pinging is detected.

 

From Wikipedia for the FJ which in latter years had the same Dual VVT-i engine:
The FJ Cruiser uses the 4.0-liter 1GR-FE DOHC V6. For the 2007 to 2009 model years, the engine came with single variable valve timing (VVT-i) which produces 239 hp (178 kW) at 5200 rpm, and 278 lb⋅ft (377 N⋅m) of torque at 3,700 rpm on 91 octane fuel.[26][27][28][29] For the 2010 model year, the FJ Cruiser's engine gained Dual VVT-i technology which adjusts timing on both intake and exhaust camshafts resulting in 259 hp (193 kW) at 5600 rpm, and 270 lb⋅ft (366 N⋅m) on 91 octane, in addition to slightly improved fuel economy on 91 octane fuel.[26][30] For model year 2011, these figures rose to 260 hp (194 kW) at 5600 rpm, and 271 lb⋅ft (367 N⋅m).[31] The 2011 onwards engine meets stringent LEV II/Tier 2 Bin 5 emissions certification[32] Both versions of the 1GR-FE engine run normally on 87 octane fuel[26] though they produce less power thus Toyota recommends premium fuel for demanding situations such as towing, off-roading, and driving at high elevation.

 

Where are you seeing this? Nothing about it in my manual.

 

Wikipedia, I just pulled up the 1GR-FE and these were the specs for the FJ which had the Dual VVti, same engine from 2010 and up. It's no secret these engines aren't going to net a lot of power with or with out high octane. They do have a 10.4:1 compression ratio so because of the Dual VVT-i, they can optimize the higher octane whether it MIGHT be in mileage, or towing a trailer over a mountain pass. Doubtful on the mileage lol.

If your expecting wheel stands on one tank or 50 tanks of premium? Not happening. I don't think whatever power gains that you might see are worth the extra money either. It's a personal preference. Now my 03' 2UZ-FE V8 only has 9.6:1 compression ratio, and I don't care if I put 100 octane in it, it cannot make use of it. My old Chevy small block with 10.5:1 compression wouldn't run on anything but high octane. No VVT-i and knock sensor=pre ignition detonation. That's the beauty of the Dual VVT-i, it can run just fine on 87 under normal circumstances.
I also don't think that Toyota will publish these possible higher power gains in the 4Runner owners manual so as to avoid more EPA restrictions and higher guzzler taxes.
All I know is that when I'm loaded down (over 6k lbs) with gear going up a Mountain on a hot day, 87 makes this poor thing rattle like a diesel. Next time I did it on 93 she had a much easier time. These ECUs also have what are called fuel maps. The computer remembers and it takes several thousand miles of high octane to actually realize the benefits. I doubt that much gain in mileage will be noticeable even then. So in that sense I have wasted my money for years and for some reason it drives people crazy that I admit it.
But the main thing is with 87 these trucks will do just fine and I still say the biggest crime is most people never take them off road.

 

It's confusing because, as you mentioned, the dual VVT-I 1GR has high enough compression to make use of higher octane fuel, but also personal experience and the manual suggest that it's a waste.

I have tried premium in the '15 Taco and the 4Runner out of curiosity with 0 difference from regular.

Environmental factors could affect this as well. Altitude, ambient temperature, ETC.

 

Wow you were not kidding. I stopped reading after a minute,lol

 

Top tier 87 works fine for me. I will add that I run a bottle of Techron through the system every 5k miles or so.

 

That was one of the first things I learned about modern cars, was fuel mapping. Most people will never spend the money on premium to realize the true gains in performance. And they will be minimal anyway. The ECU is programmed to a certain tune and it takes several thousand miles for that that tune to change. Seat time on a dyno might be able to prove some of this, but you also have traction control to contend with so true numbers aren't recorded. All of this is just conjecture anyway because well, we are talking about a 5k lb behemoth with the aerodynamics of a brick.

 

I would be interested to see a long term test where 2 identical 4runners are driven in the same conditions with one using regular and the other using premium. This would be the only way to prove that there is a difference.

In the meantime, I will continue to run top tier 87 and save my money.

 

I also don't have a regular commute and my mileage is paid for going to work anyway, so that enables me to run premium. But, if my budget depended on it? No way.
So I don't blame anyone for not wanting to pay the ridiculous price for premium. I just want to inform people that just because the manual says 87 or higher, does not mean that these trucks won't run well on one or the other or that premium does not have it's small advantages. 10.4:1 compression and the Dual VVt-i will burn that 87 and premium just the same. If you want to really have some fun, drop it in 4Lo, find some sand and stomp on it, the rev limiter sound is pretty cool.
These engines/transmissions might be tuned like pigs, but they are very capable and longevity seems to be in their heritage.
Now if we could just get Toyota corporate to stop with soy base wiring......
On a side note about Ethanol...in my 03' V8 with DT headers and Y pipe, it was produced way before the mandate on E10. I started running ethanol free and it has really responded well to that stuff. But that's another rabbit hole for another day.

 

What kind of mileage do you get on premium?

Yeah, the ethanol thing is a whole can of worms on it's own. I tried ethanol free on my '03 a few times with 0 difference from E10. On the '19, I run E15 occasionally as well and it makes no difference.

 

Yea there again, I'm not looking for mileage. The 5th gen weighs over 5700 lbs with out camping gear and with Cooper MTs behind a steel bumper? What I did notice was how bad it went changing from ATPs to STT Pros. Like 1.5 miles a gallon loss. Each one of those little knobbys catching air reduces my mileage by a 1/10 of a gallon. I'd rather not think about how bad my mileage is. But when I pull this bloated pig up a mountain, the premium fuel makes a difference.
Now on the E10 subject, the headers and Y pipe really opened the V8 up. So maybe in that scenario I notice more performance with the Non Ethanol.
I had a Civic tuner pass me the other night on the interstate. I decided to roll up on him a couple miles later and he put it down. I stayed with him for a while and we both backed off at about 115-120 mph. Now I doubt he really kicked that Honda in the ass, but it was fun anyway.

 

Even an empty 4Runner isn't keeping up with a Civic, so the guy was probably just having fun with you. Unless it was an older Civic?

The video looks fun. Mine moves pretty good, too, for a brick.

 

Huh, the video wouldn't load for me so I deleted it lol.