TRD Pro vs Off road with KDSS

I enjoyed reading similar discussions last year while I was trying to decide on a Pro versus an ORD with KDSS. Seeing what members stated about what they liked/disliked with those trims helped me to choose which one I’d be happiest with.

All of us need to choose what’s right for our personal lives and the types of activities we plan to do with our 4Runners.

 

As I stated earlier I was unaware of the difference between the Canadian and US Off Road's. I ate crow and realized my initial comparison was incorrect.

Canadian models come standard with sunroof, KDSS, auto headlights, dual climate control, MTM and remote start.

The current difference between the ORP and Pro in Canada is $10,840 so my sentiment (Towards the Canadian market) remains unchanged.

 

The valves open, not close, below a certain speed (12 MPH IIRC), allowing slow speed articulation. I'd be curious to hear where it performed worse off-road. I do understand it can cause a rough ride in high speed situations, though.

I perfectly understand the physics of driving a tall, heavy, BOF vehicle, and that's exactly why I enjoy the reduced body roll. I don't try to drive it like a sports car, but the improved stability is nice when driving on twisty rural roads.

Also, no PRO hate here. I think they're perfect for a certain part of the market, just like KDSS seemed perfect for me at first.

 

Are all TRD pros supposed to be equipped with the remote start? I tried to recommend the sequence and it does not remote start.

 

nah bruh.. the kdss difference -

Driving through paved 2 lane roads in the foothills of the front range:

- with my forester, I could keep up with normal traffic, stick to the speed limit, going over it at times.

- with 4R sr5, it felt down right dangerous taking those curves in flow of traffic. Huge regression compared to the forester

- with 4R Kdss, the dynamics when taking those curves are fairly equivalent to the forester.

 

App is the easiest. No guessing work.

 

Very well said. I live in an area where I drive mostly twisty backroads so KDSS was definitely a must for me. It has nothing to do with driving an SUV like a sports car (people that say that likely have never even driven a 4R with KDSS).

Like you, I also don’t hate on the Pros. I just needed to assess the differences and choose which trim fit my interests the best.

 

In your neck of the woods, I found the body roll most problematic when trying to keep up with traffic eastbound on I-70 in that wiggly stretch between Idaho Springs and the foot of the front range.

 

Oh I can relate! I've also shopped Jeeps and Broncos. They both look nice, and have some nice features, but the reliability just is not there.

 

Yeah that part has much higher avg speed.

the roads I was referring to max out around 40mph, with much tighter curves

 

Yes, it's certainly a thing on the 40 mph mountain twisties.

 

I have owned a 4R with KDSS and know very well how it drives, so my comment about driving is based on experience.

Dirty Harry - please give me a road location in central NY where KDSS is a must for you. I'd love to take my Pro on the same stretch when I'm next in the area to find out exactly the situation you think makes KDSS so critical. I've had no problem keeping up with traffic on any road across all different areas including mountain roads without KDSS.

 

It can be a little finicky with the fob but at least for me, once I tried a few times, I got the feel for it.

As kmeeg said, the app is the way to go, no guess work and no range limitation so I've shifted to using that 99% of the time.

 

Wow I'm not ready for my 4R to be on an app yet

 

thanks too, for this thread!
I keep learning. You can never know too much about your KDSS system.
Like @Slopemaster said, for sure get that PRO if you got the budget. I know I've heard of semi-rare issues with the PRO's, aside from things installed at port. And I've heard of semi-rare issues with KDSS piston and system. They're both outstanding vehicles. They both could use tire upgrades imo, and ORP needs leveling and KDSS kill switch, and PRO roof rack can get dropped at the transfer station.

 

You can stress your lack of desire for KDSS all you want but it won’t change the fact that I prefer having it and most definitely feel far less body roll than my previous 4Runners. Our dog and cats also seem to appreciate it since none of them have puked while being in the new 4R.

I won’t tell you exact location because frankly most people up here get annoyed when “downstaters” come up and do dumb shit like ignore No Trespassing signs and 4-wheel on our private properties while tossing beer cans and trash out their windows. The arrogance is astounding when these trespassers start spewing nonsensical excuses for their behavior too.

 

I wasn't stressing anything, just correcting a false assumption you made.

Thanks for the song and dance based on more assumptions about me and why you can't give an example of a public road where KDSS is so invaluable so I might be able to test this out myself. I think perhaps you should look in the mirror and reevaluate where all the arrogance and nonsensical excuses are coming from....

 

Arrogance and assumptions? Yes, like assuming we want to drive SUVs like sports cars just because we have KDSS?

You’re demonstrating the mentality of why people up here can’t stand when downstaters arrive. The vast majority are over opinionated and highly arrogant. I’m sure you know those traits quite well and have spent years mastering them.

 

I opted out of KDSS for longevity and ease of future modifications.
It's a great system to be fair, but I prefer simpler designs with less moving parts.

On the streets there is some body roll. It's an SUV. You get used to it.
On the trails it still flexes decently if you haven't over sprung the suspension. (Large lift springs typically means less flex)

90% of 4runner owners will never flex out their rig enough to lift a wheel. Of that 10%, even less will get close to rolling due to lack of flex...
If you are a fellow wheel lifter, I applaud you!

 

I love a good KDSS fight as much as anyone

 

I think the OP has moved on...

 

I was just checking out your build page, very nice! The TRD wheels and the tires make a big difference IMO. It ever looks good at the stock ride height. It looks like you were able to buy it like that off the lot??? They all come with street tires around here.

 

Yes the wheels and tires can with the stock 4R

 

Isn't KDSS to be blamed here? For a solid axle that's not great. I am curious to see how Pro's rear travel is.

 

If I recall correctly from one of tinkerer’s adventure video, kdss has less articulation at the rear but more at the front than non kdss (not sure about the pro but I’d think results would be similar to non kdss off road trim). Also kdss is slightly less good during off camber lean.

 

The non-KDSS versions have a little more rear flex than ours. But, we have significantly more in front, and more overall flex.

I've heard that the sway bars move independently when the valves are open, so I've considered deleting the rear sway bar for even better flex. But, I need to somehow confirm that it won't screw up the system first.

 

Correct. And, that includes the PRO since it uses the same sway bar as the other non-kdss models (not sure about the limited, though; I thought I heard that the limited has different sway bars from the other models).

 

I lifted the front passenger and rear driver, so it wasn't a great feeling, specially when the disconnected Jeep was watching lol. A-Trac saved the day.