RIP 4Runner

I'm sure people said that when every new generation of the 4Runner came out after the first. It's fine, this thing is going to sell like hotcakes.

I mostly like the look, other than the front end. My major gripe with it is that I do not like the interior at all, and that the rear seat no longer folds totally flat.

I bet it drives great though, torque peak below 2K is a huge improvement over the 4-point slow.

 

Very well said, I'm disappointed they didn't put more into the t4r for the 6th Gen. Gx would have to be my go to if I needed to replace my 5th Gen now.

 

yeah the 4L is gutless below about 3k rpm and really shines at 4k rpm. you pretty much have to WOT trying to get that beast to get moving in big city merging to get up to 70 mph in typical ATL driving on i285 when i go back home to visit.

 

I had one exactly like that. It was my first 4Runner and I'm now on my 4th. That 2003 Silver V8 FT4wd may have been the best one of the bunch, and I wish I still had it.

 

Yes, it truly is a manual lever that truly directly shifts the transfer case.








However, the transfer case is only responsible for engaging the front driveshaft. Complete 4wd engagement requires that the front diff connects to the front cv axles. That’s done with the ADD, which is an electro-mechanical actuator.

The reason a lever is desirable is because it lets you feel what these transfer cases doing. For example, it’s really easy to shift at a bad moment and the lever will let you know that the trans case did not like the shift. You learn to avoid shifting in those conditions. But with a dial, an electro-mechanical actuator does the shifting, and if you’re shifting at a bad time, you’ll just wonder why the light is blinking and it doesn’t want to engage. It makes it harder to learn what the machine likes and doesn’t like .

Having a lever also means it’s one less actuator to fail. It’s not uncommon for them to seize up on older 4runners that aren’t used very frequently in four-wheel-drive. Replacing the TC actuator is actually more difficult (requires splitting the case),and probably more expensive than buying a new transfer case. Sure, you’ll still have the ADD that can fail, but those can be replaced by a mechanichally inclined novice willing to put in a few hours of work.

 

Its funny how many people still think that if a cars exhaust note doesn't rumble like a 1968 Chevelle SS its no good. And yet half these millennial and post millennial kids complaining have probably never even sat in an American V8 much less driven one.


I remember when we used to have a 90s Suburban with the 350 that my dad used for his carpentry business. Hell yeah that truck rumbled like a real mans truck. You could climb into the engine bay and sit on the fenders when working on it. But it had the acceleration of a Sherman tank and was an absolute $*$)(^ to try and park anywhere. I drove it quite a bit helping my dad when I was in college and hated it.

Conversely the first car I ever bought cash with my own money was a 2003 Acura RSX S-type. basically a renamed Integra. 200hp naturally aspirated VTEC 2.0 inline 4. It only had ~140ft-lb of torque most of that was up high around 3000-6000rpm. But it peaked out at 200hp at 7800rpm, just a split second before the rev limiter would kick in at 8100. Putting your foot in it and running it to redline through the first couple gears put an ear to ear gin on my face. It screamed like a formula 1 car and could light up the tires no prob in first gear in spite of that "lowly" torque. (remember all you need to turn peaky horsepower into a boatload of wheel torque is short gearing) If you where not afraid of "fast engine sounds" and drove it like you stole it its was one of the most fun street cars Ive had. You had to stop at 3rd gear however, redline past 2nd could get you arrested...

BTW, drove it for 11 years and ran that engine to 8000 rpm almost daily and the only thing that ever needed replacing was a bad secondary o2 sensor around 60k. Took me 10minutes to change.

 

what he said ^^^



but it really comes down to, would you rather a $50 part break or a $1000 part break.

 

omg that brings back memories of a girlfriends old delta 88 with a 454 in it. big @$$ boat, heavy as a tank and moved like molasses off the line.

 

I am positive the Toyota GM's have a 5/10 year plan and that eventually come to the conclusion they have too many SUV's in their lineup. Seqouia, LandCruiser, 4 Runner, Rav 4. More than likely they will babystep shrink the 4 runner down both in weight and interior space to appease the emissions board. Eventually remove the Rav4. The new 4 Runner will probably be their low end line up where the Land Cruiser and Seqouia their new mid top trims. This would give them the opportunity to gently nudge you over to one of their other models. The Land Cruiser could be the new "4 Runner" to own for future gens. We just happen to be on the cusp of that change. Hooray for the 5th gens, last of a dying breed before they shrink them down. If I stayed with Toyota, I could be swayed to go for a Land Cruiser if they make it more rugged like the originals. I'd be ok with the next gen 4 runners being the entry level stuff for the kiddos. I always had a fond place in my heart for those older Land Cruisers from the 70s. Rugged as Hell. . .





https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a60442127/2025-toyota-4runner-2024-toyota-land-cruiser-compared/

 

the rav4 should have stayed small like the first few gen's. currently its way to big. now you have to compete with the highlander and grand highlander (which beats the shit out of the sequoia on interior specs).

uni-body
corolla cross > rav4 > venza > highlander > grand highlander

bof
4runner > lc250 > sequoia

the problem you have is interior wise and functionality the overlapped is starting to blur pretty bad and the main driving force (moms and kids) this is the layout for those soccer moms

corolla cross > rav4 > venza > highlander > 4runner > lc250 > sequoia > grand highlander

i do see that the price points caters from the low end to the high end and what function its filling

 

heheh.. probably cool as hell though.

Im a car nut. My dad was a car nut. I like new but I also like old. Oldest car I ever got a ride in was a 1915 model T... they guy wouldnt let me drive it but I really wanted to. Also have ridden in Model As, a 1938 Dodge couple and the oldest I got to drive myself was a 1955 Chevy sedan with the straight 6 and 3 on the tree. You think driving a 5th gen on the highway is scary, try approaching an intersection with non-power 4 wheel drum brakes

Over the years Ive had the chance to drive all kinds of varying things... gen 3 1980s Vett that a cousin owned(sadly was an auto), my high school friends Dad 1980s F250 with manual hubs and a 4speed manual, varous other Ford, Chevy pickups. As a kid my Dad was really into British and European sports cars so I got rides in and/or drove Jags, MGs, and even once a diesel Peuogot. In college I drove my roomates gen 1 Tacoma with manual. My own gen 2 Tacoma auto with an even slower version of the 4.0.. Right after college all my friends where into 90s/2000s hot hatches and sport sedans - We all drove each others - I had the Acura, my best buddy had a bugeye WRX with cobb stage 2 pack, one roomate had a use E36 M3 and another had a B5 generation Audi S4.One guy even had a 1970s Alfa Romeo Spider convertable ( the kind that had mechanical fuel injection)... that was the wierdest to drive oof all as you where seated low and reclined back like a race car but the gearshift lever was as long as a truck. I also got to drive a few generations of Miata's and those where almost too perfect for hte road... just enough to have fun but not so good you couldnt legally push them. I even got a ride in a couple differnet Teslas and as much as we all love torque those will push you back in your seat like no gasoline car Ive ever driven.

Point is, the spice of life is to try it all and have fun.

 

yeah i had some interesting chances as a teen that i was too stupid to realize until 20+ yrs later.

had a chance to buy a yenko camaro but didnt like the color and had no clue what a yenko was (this was the late 70s early 80's i think (1979 or 1980)

also was shown a cosworth vega with side draft webbers with the EFI ripped out. really didnt like the body style of a vega and it was brown. but man that engine was worth its weight in gold


forgot to add, this was family selling pricing back then.

 

Did they swap out from the stock Oldsmobile engine to the 454? The olds 455 would have been a hoot also back then.

That would have been wild.

 

it was mom's car that she let the daughter drive around. thank god the 80's had cheap gas. scrounging up $5 or $10 gas to cruise the night.

it was very old when she drove it (girlfriend). but it was stock with a 454 from what i remember (i was just starting high school in 1981)

 

I think the Sequoia should probably go away. I don't know the official sales numbers, but since they came out I've only seen a handful of them. It's not that's a bad product, but I just don't think that Toyota can compete in this segment. GM and Ford own the full size SUV segment.

I like the lc250, but I kind of think that the Land Cruiser should have went away too, at least in the US. Name recognition is good, but sales have never been high. I think there's too much overlap between the GX and LC pricing, and I'm sure the 4Runner will end up right in that same range as well.

The Rav4 has gotten bigger, but with the hybrid option it's relatively fuel efficient and a great vehicle for a lot of people. I just wish that they would make an version with actual off-road capability, at least comparable to a Subaru. Kind of like what Jeep did with the KL Cherokee, having a low-range and mechanical locking diff. Just with a much better execution, of course.

Do people even buy Venzas? I see a lot of the first gens around, I think they're decent looking cars, the current generation just looks awkward and I really don't see a reason for it to exist.

I think the Corolla cross looks decent, but it's just a very bland vehicle. I do think it's a perfect "starter" kind of vehicle, for the people that originally bought RAV4s.

 

and to continue my other discussion. just be mindful i was 15 yr kid at the time and was not into cars and my mom offered to buy me a car (new or used)

the yenko was yellow, meh i didnt like yellow (plus uncle eddie had died recently and it was his car, so i wasnt to keen on it)

the vega, outside of the engine (since it was a cosworth) i really didnt like the color or the body

next was a rx-7 red, like it alot, drove it around over the weekend with the girls (amanda and sharon) with the back flipped up (and sucked the fumes in doing that). very fun but it was used and meh

finally saw a toyota celica gt fastback in dark blue with the rear black window louvers, fell in love with it, flip up head lights, great stereo (at the time) and it was brand new and way more sporty looking than the camaro, vega, rx-7.

boy was i dumb looking back, but man the memories from high school couldnt be beat.

 

1. rav4 does have a off road theme one, called the adventure
2. venza just needs to die, the gap between the current rav4 and highlander is so minute that the cost difference isnt worth it.
3. grand highlander will eat the highlander sales, might as well kill it cause the gap between the rav4 and highlander is minor interior wise, but price wise its a pretty big gap to jump
4. the cross is great to get a cheap suv, but man it lacks alot of features that you should just save up and get a rav4 (not the LE)
5. the LC250 is in a weird spot. its technically the same as a 4runner, but it does have a very small niche for those that want the featues of the limited with the features of the trd pro which you cant get in the 4runner line but can in a LC250 in 1 package
6. once the grand highlander came out, it clobbered the sequoia in everything that people were looking for in the sequoia.

 

RAV4 Adventure, and TRD for that matter, are pretty much just appearance packages. I've seen multiple video reviews of these, they don't compare to a Subaru in capability. And I'm not a Subaru fan, they're really not off-road vehicles either, but at least they do have decent soft roader capability.

 

Thanks for the explanation I can appreciate all this. This is how we learn

 

Your life sounds a lot like mine. I've been into cars and bikes for my entire life. Ridden and driven more "classic" cars than I can count. Been in that scene for years. I agree wholeheartedly that you should enjoy life try as many as you can. I had one fella comment on my VW Scout post that said he would "never own a Volkswagen". I found that hard to believe and thought he probably said that because he just worked for Toyota. Especially given their pedigree and the brands that fall under their ownership. There aren't too many brands I would wash away entirely on name or reputation alone. I can always find something from any one brand I would consider owning.

 

Hehe hell yeah. And I left out a lot of the less interesting ones - like all the Toyota sedans, Honda Civics and Accords we owned over the years all the way back to an original '77 Civic CVCC hatchback in Yellow. Some of my first exposure to wrenching was helping my Dad work on that one in grade school. Or all the various SUVs of different makes and models we had. Including an early gen Pathfinder... and a Ford Exploer my mom owned that was from the time period of the Firestone tire debacle (and was living in Detroit at the time). Or the road trip cars--- when I was really young we had one of those 1970s two tone Dodge vans iwth all hte stickers on hte window and later they got a (sencond gen i think?) Ford Taurus wagon - that one caught fire on the highway once (poser steering line blew and sprayed fluid all over the exhaust) and my dad keeps an extinguisher in the car to this day as a result.

Oooh... another fun one I forgot. Another college buddy was a Vovlo nut and built one of those "Turbo Brick" conversions - 1980sometihng 240 wagon with a Ford v8 swap. He scared the you know what out of me driving that around.


I was into bikes for a while too and got my license but the mrs. put her foot down that was a non negotiable when we married....

 

I wonder how Toyota determines where the first one off the assembly line goes. 1 of 100,000+

 

you will never see 1 in the hands of a regular consumer as far as toyota is concerned for regular models. halo models are different (LFA as an example)

mules are are part of the numbering.

 

Useful Torque no doubt. 5th gen just looks better. Less blocky, less body panel layers, smoother lines. Less is more. I honestly like my front end quite a bit more. Also, do 6th gen taillights look too small now to anyone else, they don't wow me.

 

The not so distant future....

My uncle has a country place
That no one knows about
He says it used to be a farm
Before the Motor Law
And on Sundays I elude the eyes
And hop the Turbine Freight
To far outside the Wire
Where my white-haired uncle waits

Jump to the ground
As the Turbo slows to cross the borderline
Run like the wind
As excitement shivers up and down my spine
Down in his barn
My uncle preserved for me an old machine
For fifty odd years
To keep it as new has been his dearest dream

I strip away the old debris
That hides a shining car
A brilliant 5th Gen 4 Runner
From a better vanished time
I fire up the willing engine
Responding with a roar
Tires spitting gravel
I commit my weekly crime. . . .

 

Great song and I like your sentiment

 

I absolutely hate the new front end, I agree with you there. The rest of the body lines I like, though I think the fender flare setup is not the best. I like the black flares, but I do not like that they don't continue all the way down to the rockers. Same issue with the taco, Tundra, and Sequoia.

To be honest though, I don't think the front end of the 5th gen is very good looking either. The angry catfish look is so out of date, it reminds me of an early '00s era tuner body kit.

I really think the 5th gens need an aftermarket front bumper to look good, and the viper cuts on stock bimpers look like trash.

 

Ouch!

 

It looks good on yours though!

 

Just mine?

I would definitely agree that it's situational.