How to disconnect the tracking telemetry on the 5th gen 4Runner

I don’t know the answer to that specific question, but model year 2019 and prior 4Runners used the 3G cellular system, which is now basically defunct. Toyota will discontinue Connected Services for those vehicles on November 1st.

In this statement by Toyota regarding the retirement of 3G they say that 4Runners from 2010 to 2019 will be affected, which would seem to indicate that some level of telematics have been present since 2010…

https://www.toyota.com/audio-multimedia/support/3g-faq/

 

Great link... thank you for posting. this suggests that 2010 was the first year of telematics.

 

Leave it at home if I choose to. A vehicle is essential, a phone is not

 

That’s interesting. Perhaps for the week that the display was grayed out the DCM was running on a backup battery, and after the battery was exhausted the display disappeared. I wonder whether, if you temporarily replaced the fuse, the display would return.

After I phoned in to have my DCM disconnected the meter still showed signal strength bars. Now, a few months later, the bars are all grayed and crossed out - even in my driveway where previously there were a couple of bars.

 

This is my thoughts on it as well.

 

New to this site from T4R, looking to potentially uograde from a 15 to a 2022-23 4R, however I value Freedom and don't like the idea of the possibility of a government or hackers turn off my engine or hit the breaks while I'm driving. Interested in removing this feature like many of you and rooting for a solution to this invasive and predatory hardware/software on unsuspecting buyers.

 

If you don't care to lose the bluetooth mic, this is the way.

 

I definitely have said things in my vehicle that will lower my "Toyota score".

 

So far, the only "convenient" way to do it is removing the fuse, but you lose Bluetooth microphone capability. For me that's no biggy, but for others it's not ideal.

 

If we rewind many pages, there's recommendations to simply get the Toyota app and disable everything. It works. Info center shows no comms, overhead LED is red (no comms) at all times. Why not do that?

 

Best example I have is, "Even when your phone with a factory operating system is asleep, it's still very busy."

 

yup!

 

You can, but you're opting out of services, which doesn't have much relation to data collection by manufacturers for sale to third parties.

I thought this was a pretty good article explaining how manufacturers can (and do) capitalize on vehicle data. For me, it's kind of a kick in the teeth to become a continuous cash cow for a company, without my permission, after already paying for all of the hardware a vehicle comes with.

https://www.motorfinanceonline.com/...ata-a-key-opportunity-for-auto-manufacturers/

 

Help me out here man. If you completely disconnect everything via the app, what services am I opting out of? Nothing that I'm aware of, but I'd like to know if I'm missing something. And if disconnected via the app, what data collection by the manufacturer continues?

 

Good article. Right now, at least for 4Runners, you can disable the real-time tracking and data collecting. But in future vehicles it may not be so easy and it may cripple many desirable features. But the bulk of car buying consumers are ignorant of what’s being collected or they don’t care as long as they have cool features. There’s money to be made, so this trend will accelerate.
Enjoy your old tech mostly private 4Runner while you can.

 

What info does your TV collect? Your connected thermostat, light bulbs, security cameras, cell phone, fridge, gaming system, echo/cortana/siri/Amazon assistant, irrigation system, etc.? I don't know because there arent any universal rules to disclose that info. That's kinda the problem. The EU is cracking down on this issue, but the US seems to be a little behind.

 

I appreciate your response, but that doesn't answer the question - it poses more questions. None of which I have the answer to. The only thing I know is that disconnecting via the app appears to show the same "disconnected" signals as pulling the antennas - no signal on the head unit, overhead LED is red which means no signal. If you have something that shows different, I'd like to see it.

 

I was trying to think of a good analogy here. Best I can come up with is a cable modem. If you don't pay for service, you don't get Internet access and your cable modem probably has a red or blinking green light to let you know....but all the other lights are on, also - the RX, TX, etc. Apps ride on top of connections which ride on top of logical and physical transport layers. Disabling all services via the Toyota app may cause the DCM icon to gray out but there's no way to know what that really means - it could just be the DCM app on the 4Runner itself while the connections, logical, and physical layers remain intact.

Putting it another way - the red LED could exactly mean that there is no connectivity or response from the Toyota mother ship, or it could exactly mean that the SOS services are disabled based on the response from the mother ship (which implicitly means it is always connected and the mother ship is telling it the services are deactivated)

I'm not trying to opine one way or the other on the issue at hand, just sharing perspective on the connectivity aspect based on some experience in application development and computer-based technology. For some really dry reading, search on the OSI model and you'll find a little more about the layers I mentioned and how they relate to this scenario.

 

I dont think toyota is offering any compelling services through their connected app. Maybe the “on-star” type emergency system through the SOS button. I think the connected app is also needed for remote start, if not already, then soon. Also, wifi needs a connection IRC.

other than that, I really didnt see anything remotely useful or interesting.

As far as what data collection continues…there are some good responses already.

But even if we knew what is collected, and with whom it’s shared, something tells me our use of our vehicle is an acceptance of the “user agreement”. Which probably states somewhere that they have the right to change the agreement at any time without notice. Like they all do. Bastards lol

 

Yes. A physical air gap is always the best assurance of privacy. In this case the air gap is achieved by pulling the DCM fuse and unplugging the antennas from the DCM. Opting out via the app or a phone call relies on trusting Toyota to keep their word that they will no longer collect or distribute our personal data. It doesn’t prevent Toyota from unilaterally reinstating those services if mandated by regulation or court order.

It’s interesting that when I called to have my DCM disconnected I was warned that if I changed my mind and wanted those services reconnected I would have to take my truck to the dealer to have the DCM “re-flashed”. Whether or not that is true I don’t know…

 

My DCM fuse has been unplugged since December '21 and I don't have any SOS light, red or green, and no signal via the DCM. I started by unplugging the antenna cables, but I would see it catch a signal when close to a cell tower, and the app would update with mileage and tire pressure. Unplugging the DCM fuse stopped that, and I haven't had any issues since. App stopped updating right away, and has since been deleted from my phone (was using it to test the effectiveness of data transfer).

Just took a couple of photos...

 

It is conceivable that when you opt out the mothership sends a message to the receiver to “go deaf” and turn off its communication channel. Probably writing to a flash memory address to power that circuit off. Then to turn it back on a dealer would need to physically plug in to the port and write the “turn on comms” command to that one address location.

 

As I said elsewhere in this behemoth thread, the behavior of the DCM display has changed since I first had it disconnected by Toyota. Pressing the SOS button gave a canned message to call Toyota Safety Connect to have service reinstated. The DCM signal strength bars were still apparent, and while sitting in my driveway there were always a couple of bars. Now, after several weeks have passed, the display is different. In my driveway the DCM meter now shows greyed bars crossed out. In fact that’s what the meter shows all the time. This would lend credence to the theory of the mother ship sending a “go deaf” command.

 

What year and trim level 4Runner do you have?

 

Just updating for anyone that is curious, nothing still hasn't happened since unplugging antennas and pulling DCM fuse on my 2022 sometime back in the summer of 2022.

 

Wow... this is some thread... and I came across it when I asked: "Is my car was connected to the manufacturer" in a different thread.

What we are trying to achieve here is privacy. It is MY information. It belongs to ME, and I decide who gets it and how it is being used. And for me, THIS is the issue.

I don't need Toyota selling my whereabouts and other information. And if Toyota can get paid for selling my information to someone else why isn't Toyota buying my information from me?

More importantly, short of physically disconnecting the car from the network, there is no way to be certain your information isn't being accessed through a back door.

I believe I read somewhere in this War & Peace of a thread that when we opt out with Toyota, you must return to the dealership for reactivation. If this is true, it leads me to believe that some physical intervention is required to turn the radio back on. So opting out would appear to leave the DCM incapacitated.

Disconnecting the antenna wire isn't 100% effective because close proximity to a cell tower would still allow a connection.

And for those of you who have suggested the SIM removal, I don't believe this is a solution. As I understand it, it doesn't have a traditional SIM card which can be removed, but instead, an electronic SIM, which wouldn't be removable. While I think it is highly unlikely, a removable SIM could vibrate free of its seat in the socket.

 

There may be more than one type of opting out. Just declining the Connected Services subscription doesn’t disable the DCM.

Pulling the DCM fuse is the surest way, but doing so will cost the you the use of the hands-free mic and perhaps a speaker depending on the year.

… and getting physical access to the dcm is a big deal.

 

The same way a SIM won’t come loose in a phone, I strongly doubt it could come loose in a telematics unit. And eSIMs have only been an option for the past few years. Given the speed of automotive development, I doubt these units have support for them. There’s most likely a SIM card somewhere in the car, unless it’s burned into the cellular chip which is more likely, else someone would’ve found the SIM by now.

Believe it or not, these companies aren’t out to get you, and the Toyota app allows you to opt out of any information sharing. We’ll see if I start getting insurance quotes anyway, but I won’t because I opted out.

Unfortunately we still don’t have any legal basis for a right to privacy in the US, so while I agree with the sentiment that your information is yours and mine is mine, we don’t work that way today. Talk to your legislators. I do.

But in the end remember, it’s only paranoia if they’re not out to get you

 

Even if information is not shared it collected somewhere. I would be more concerning if Toyota get hacked and our information will be sold on dark web. Or even worse somebody takes control of the app and will see your truck location, trip history and can remotely start/shutdown engine, lock/unlock doors and so on.

 

Ultimately, that’s exactly why privacy is important. Privacy (generally speaking), is the easiest and most effective way to safeguard what’s important. That’s what you take away from people when you don’t recognize a universal right to personal privacy.

It’s a fairly fundamental concept… Seeking privacy is an innate response to threats. People live in private spaces with doors and curtains when they live around lots of other unknown people. We lock money and valuable things away from prying eyes. Animals burrow, and move quietly to keep their locations “private”. It doesnt matter if a threat isnt physically there at the present moment. Animal life is private because they have the common sense to know that dangers do exist, and loss will result from not anticipating them. Privacy is less important to people (and wildlife), when they feel safe, protected, and when they have assured themselves of no imminent threats.

People that justify snooping around in other peoples business are either 1) very naive because they have lived a life so well protected they are unable to conceptualize danger,

or 2) are powerful, and sense no moral need to consider the rights of others (in other words, people with no sense of decency), or no practical need to recognize that right (because they’ve never been punched in the face).

Or 3) they themselves rely on snooping for their benefit or daily bread.

I suppose it could also be justified by people that have given up trying to protect themselves, and subconsciously ally themselves with the offenders… a kind of stockholm syndrome response where a lot of us can be in modern times.