6th gen Speculation Thread

I'd have a hard time believing that a 6th gen 4Runner has been driving around for several years and not a single spy shot has surfaced. How would they disguise it, if not wrapping it in familiar sheet metal so that nobody notices?

 

Round headlights suck unless they are a in Jeep-like vehicle or a lil Mini Cooper kind of car. You would hate them on your 4Runner. They looked good on the FJ Cruiser because it gave you a Jeep/FJ feeling.

 

Back in 1989 I took part in a discreet (meaning invitation only) vehicle survey. The vehicles were stripped of all badges, trim and had very generic (meh) paint schemes. That was a good 2-3 years before Ford unveiled the first gen Explorer to the market. I’m doubtful, knowing that the 4Runner line has been in existence going on some 35 years now that the company would need to perform such surveys and thus any kind of public exposure for any prototype(s).

haha, my first thought was how this looks like a Mini Cooper!

 

Roll down rear window: I hope they keep it, but some are concerned that it's going away. Fingers crossed!

Better fuel economy is expected, but will definitely depend on driving habits.

Reliability is questionable at this point. The 2.4 is pretty new, so they're likely to have bugs. But, hopefully it ends up being solid.

HP looks like it will be similar, but it will have WAY more usable torque (317lb/ft @ 1700 RPM's in the Taco)

The other stuff I have no idea on.

 

I'm not so hopeful about the better fuel efficiency. It's going to become like the GX, more power just 1 MPG improvement. Expect 20 combined

 

The Taco's infotainment and HVAC are buttons so that's good! We'll probably get the same infotainment/HVAC.

 

But GX was a dinosaur with CD player and all. But I get what u r sayin

 

Agreed. I don't want to rely on a touchscreen for everything. Hopefully we at least get knobs for HVAC and a volume knob for the radio.

That number (317) is just the regular turbo 4. The hybrid version that's supposed to be offered in the Tacos (and I assume will be an option for us) is said to make 326hp and 465tq.

 

Hey, some people still listen to CD's

Side note: my '03 had a cassette deck!

 

I think it will come down to the individual driver.

~40 more lb/ft of torque, at 1700 RPM's compared to 4400, along with more gears to keep it in the sweet spot could provide a significant improvement for conservative drivers.

Those who drive aggressively, and/or tow frequently might not see an improvement at all.

 

Toyota may lose some folks to Jeep for 2 reasons. Jeep has V6 and V8. And 6th gen doesn't sound like it is a solid reply to Bronco.

 

How so? We barely know anything about it yet?

 

From Tacoma Trailhunter

 

Because no 35's? Or, what is the Taco lacking?

 

35s, angles, a front locker, better crawl ratio. Toyota should have improved at least two of those.

 

Plus now we cant boast we have a naturally breathing V6. Tons of people out there who say Toyota shouldnt do a thing and keep putting out 5th gens lol

 

We don't know the dimensions of the 6th gen yet.

The new Taco appears to have better approach and departure than the current 4Runner, and the 4Runner typically has had better approach and departure than the Taco, so no need to worry about that yet.

What is the crawl ratio of the 4th gen Taco?

Toyota is NEVER giving us a front locker, so we might as well get over it.

 

And those people don't live in the real world. We can dream, but we have to accept reality.

 

Not sure but the new Taco is no Gladiator. Better than the Ranger though as usual. The new 4Runner needs to improve the 26 degrees for heavens sakes.

 

Great point, but if it was 1989, then the Explorer was right around the corner. Leaks started spilling out in late 1989 as the "Bronco II/III" and it was officially revealed in Jan '90, before going on sale in March/April 1990 as an early 1991 model.

Ford probably had the 1991 Explorer looks dialed down around 1986-87, from reading the Firestone lawsuit testimonies from Ford engineers. Are you sure it wasn't around then instead?

From what I've stated, yep Toyota has been testing the new 4Runner for a long time, whether in Japan or here in North America. Design was probably created at the same time as the new Land Cruiser 250, but other aspects are behind in development.

Spy shots are a marketing thing in most cases, followed by a pressing need to do certain milestone daylight tests in the public atmosphere, before a point of no return. Most of the time, future stuff is cleverly tested at night and spy shotters don't see em.

How do I know that? They've said it in retrospect. All of em do it, especially Toyota and Honda. Test publicly at night, in low traffic areas.

Anyone who doesn't believe it, it's their own issue TBH. Toyota definitely tests these cars either on their own proving grounds, far off the grid in secured zones or rural area, or at night on certain public roads. There's a reason why we rarely see spy photos taken at night and lack of prototype testing has zero to do with it...

 

People already wheel the shit out of Tacos. With the right mods, approach and departure angle are easy to work around.

 

Nobody is denying that they're being tested already. But, why wouldn't they just make it look like a current vehicle rather than sneaking around at night?

 

Oh I am certain of the year (and more specifically the survey took place around early summer). That video cover photo, just imagine all chrome stripped off, some kind of matte-black finish on the exterior, the kind of wheels/rims that screamed "I am a spare!" They did everything to dumb-down the looks but you could tell at one glance that this was something 'different' at the time. I immediately knew the moment I got into the drivers seat that it was a Ford...can't ignore that oval depression on the steering wheel where a Ford logo would be (Chevy's a rectangle and GMC more like a square)...those engineers thought they could slip that detail by on me.

So, this survey group that I participated in was probably the last one where Ford was looking to finish marketing validation on the production model. Their engineers asked a ton of 'user experience' type questions after test drives, looking for feedback on such things as drivability, comfort. etc. When it was asked of me "do you have any other comments or questions...", they found out real quick that maybe we shouldn't use this guys testimony (they were video recording the interview). I gave em a laundry list of issues I found with that one test drive.

 

I think people would be less resistant in going to a turbo 4 set up if the 22 Tundra roll out was smoother. The truth is, at this time we still don't know if the Turbo 6 and Hybrid Tundras will eventually match the reliability of the 21 and older ones.

 

Testing in old bodies? Not a given. Those would be just mules, not fully integrated prototype vehicles, which mirror the production model. It doesn't really work like that long term, but it does in the short term. In this case, probably not even because of TNGAF.

In early testing stages, it's fine to use experimental mules to test new technologies, methods, or individual components. As well as mechanical mules, based on the production platform, dimensions, & basic specs, but not for everything.

A fully functional prototype vehicle must be reflective of the final article eventually and in Toyota's case, it's far more likely, they already built mules and it's not based on the 5th Gen. But another TNGA-F off the shelf vehicle.

What I might say here is, the only mules wearing the current generations sheet metal would probably be early experimental mules, if they were built even at all. For mechanical mules? I doubt they used anything non-TNGA off the shelf.

The new Tacoma had mechanical prototype mules in 2021, wearing a hodgepodge of modified Tundra sheet metal, instead of 3rd gen body panels, because of TNGAF.



Toyota might've used almost any kind of TNGAF mule for the 4Runner, but I bet you wouldn't see them at all here. Toyota doesn't test those type of vehicles in the United States. The only test the final design in prototype forn, unless the vehicle is significantly engineered and tested here like the Camry, Tacoma, and Tundra,

The guy who commented on the insider seeing the new 4Runner back in March 2021, his insider probably was seeing them that early because they were supposed to enter production in August 2022 originally and not over 2 years later. They probably need to refresh the new design since it's that old now.

From what I even remember, I don't think we should see reveal anytime soon. Looking back on the reveals of the 5th, 4th, and 3rd generations, Toyota always waits until the last minute to reveal. Like literally after production even starts at Tahara.

For the 4th gen, there were no spy shots in 2001-02, although I think the first Gen 4s were built in early/mid-2001 for testing.

5th Gen, they had it dialed down in '07 and secret testing in '08, but no spy shots until this one in July of 2009.

It was revealed two months later on September 24th, AFTER production began on August 28, 2009. Sales began in late November.

Toyota also literally revealed the 4th gen September 23, 2002, about 2-3 weeks before it went on sale on October 10 or 15, 2002 [1] [2]. Here's this old thread right here on Edmunds, hyped about the '03 drip feed. We might be in the same situation as 2002 or 2009.

What a nice read just like your last reply! I love hearing old stuff like this.

I find it pretty silly when they do stuff like that to mask a vehicle. I think it would be pretty obvious to 1989-you it was a Ford, considering it looked identical to the 1989 Ranger refresh which came out the previous fall.



In fact, isn't that when the 1990 4Runner entered showrooms? I read an old newspaper from early 1989 which said the new 4-door 4Runners were going to be released in late May early June of '89 as 1990 models. Unlike JDM, American spec 4Runners began production in April 1989. JDM Hilux Surfs entered production in August 1989.

For the next gen, it was flipped around. JDM released first in September 1995, USA in Feb 1996. Ditto for Gen 4 in '02.

I honestly never saw anything special in the '91 Explorer compared to the 1990 4Runner, that made it so special and revolutionary. Jeep Cherokee XJ was really the one that got it all started in '83, only IMO. They made such a big deal about the Explorer, which was little different than the superior 4Runner.

 

Yeah, that certainly didn't help. And, it didn't help that Toyota decided to bury the part where you need to remove the cab to replace it.

I think it's reasonable to expect a turbocharged motor to have more issues than a N/A motor. It's only natural given the additional failure points.

I hope Toyota can eventually prove the naysayers wrong with the new engine. But, I'm sure there will be bugs to work out, at the very least.

 

I really wish Toyota could leave one NA motor in their lineup for the traditionalist car buyers, but I understand that they can't avoid the wrath of the EPA and the current administration in pushing ever more stringent emissions and CAFE standards.

 

Agreed. I'm all in favor of better power and fuel economy, but I'm not a fan of the government forcing manufacturers to limit our options.

 

The gov requirement is emissions, not engine type or fuel economy.

More than one way to skin a cat: https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a42662418/honda-35-v-6-engine-dohc/

Honda is taking a different approach with a redesigned v6. Toyota could do the same, but they've decided not to.

 

I thought CAFE was a factor as well.

Also, before this turns into another pissing contest about which government regulations we're bitching about specifically, I referenced power and fuel economy bcause the sixth Gen. 4runner is going to have better power and fuel economy.

Toyota tried a redesigned V6 (2GR-FKS) already, and it sucked. I say bring on the turbos!