Brake Wear Issues

I have a 2017 SR5 Premium with 45,000 miles on it. For the second time (first was before 20,000 miles), I'm being told that the front and rear brakes including rotors need to be replaced. I've never owned a vehicle that needed rotors replaced before 70,000 miles before, never mind twice so soon.

I have two questions.

1. Dealership is telling me that when they do brakes, they don't replace just pads anymore on these vehicles. This doesn't sound right to me and I know pads generally wear at 15k-20k while rotors can be good for 50k-75k or more. I've seen nothing in literature that would back this up and if you don't replace pads, it would seem obvious that the brakes would fail quickly but I can't believe people are paying $1750 every year or two for full brakes and rotors after about 20k or so.

2. Anyone else experiencing this extreme wear of the brakes without extreme usage? I'm trying to understand if it the norm for these vehicles or not.

Context - I'm located in New England. Most miles are in town or highway, not during times of heavy traffic where there is stop and go traffic or going from 70 to 0. Do not do heavily off roading, heavy loads, or tow. Vehicle is used on beach maybe a half dozen times each year with the undercarriage washed off after each time. The vehicle itself never goes into salt water or even below the high tide line. In short, other than the limited beach user with proper after care, usage on the vehicle is relatively light.

Any help or insights would be greatly appreciated.

 

Best thing to do is pop off a front wheel and look at the pad. Post some pictures here. Dealers are notorious for selling unneeded repairs. That being said 4Runners are notorious for eating brakes. 20K seems outlandish though unless you stomp on your brakes or ride them. Rotors-many dealers and shops don't want to deal with resurfacing rotors for many reasons-lazy, profit, less come backs, incompetent employees, etc. A 20K mile rotor in most cases can certainly be turned-whether the shop has the ability or inclination is another story. So again, pop off a front and back wheel, or weasel your cell phone through the wheels and take a pic of the pad material left and rotor.

 

Sounds like you’re brakes wore prematurely. I’m at 38k and my brakes are fine.

As for turning the rotors. My 12’ Sequoia eats brakes, gas and tires! My Toyota dealership has turned the rotors at least twice and I was advised that they will probably need replaced the next time brakes are due.

 

2018 with 105K miles. Original rotors and pads. 80% highway miles. Can probably get another 20K before replacement.
Sounds fishy to me.

 

I'm at about 36K miles and rotors are shoot. Already ordered replacement will be changing hopefully this weekend.

 

In what way? Vibrations? Worn below acceptable thickness?

 

Some vibration, and visually they look pretty bad. Rust spots on the main braking surface, very uneven wear and gauges.

 

I'm at 30k and have a majority of the pad left. I don't remember the exact amount left on the pad but it was less than 40% wear. But it also depends on how you drive.

Brake parts are so cheap on these things I don't see the point of doing a pad slap. All in the parts from toyota are $400 and all fours corners take 2 hours at most. I can't even get a single rotor for $400 on one of my other vehicles.

 

Did you take it to them because you were having problems with your brakes, or was this something they just mentioned while you took it in for something else. It you weren’t having problems, it sounds like they’re taking you for a ride.

I haven’t heard that they’re notorious for eating brakes. I’ve used mine in fairly tough conditions. The rears lasted me about 50k miles if I recall. The fronts had at least another 15k miles before wearing out, but I changed them at the same time. Just did cleaned the front and rear hardware, lubed the rear sliding pins (no slide pins in front), and slapped on new toyota pads. Didn’t bother with turning the rotors because they looked and felt pristine.

Sheesh, really? I’m curious, did you buy new or used? How often is the vehicle used? The reason I ask is because rust on the surface of a rotor usually indicates caliper that has seized up pretty hard, which might happen on vehicles that aren’t used frequently.

I have heard that the front 4 piston calipers are more prone to seizing, maybe because it’s 4 pistons, so more chances. Not being careful with piston retraction when doing a brake job might also explain more frequent failures, as it’s tempting to try to shove each side home even if one of the two pistons per side isn’t retrcting at the same speed, and one ends up getting cocked up a bit and maybe damage the seals.

 

My experience is similar to 7Runner. I replaced the rear (pads only) on my 2019 at around 92k miles. The front (pads only) at 117k. Replaced with genuine Toyota pads. Nowadays, the rears can wear out more quickly than the fronts. Rotors are still original. I have no idea why some are saying 4Runners eat brakes. I've had three 4Runners, and they were all easy on pads/shoes. If you drive hard and late-brake all the time, then maybe yours wear more quickly. As Rocko9999 says, pop off a wheel or two and have a look.

 

Thank you to all for the replies, they are both appreciated and helpful. The first time the brakes were replaced, I know there was a frozen caliper which could have contributed and Toyota picked up the cost of the parts and I paid labor. This time around, I asked the dealership if there was warping or just wear and they said it is all just wear, which just doesn't make sense to me.

I asked if there was anything on the vehicle that was contributing to this issue and was told no. Dealership reiterated that 30k is the norm for brakes on the trucks that they see and it's a problem you need to live with. Contacted Toyota corporate who vehemently disagreed with that. Both are pointing the figure at each other but not really taking any real action. Frustrating as heck.

The car was not brought it for brake issues. There was an issue that ended up being a loose heat shield which caused us to bring it in and they told us the both the front and rear brakes needed repair.

I'm biting the bullet and having them do the rear brakes which I'm told are the more critical of the two. I've got a long drive this weekend and don't have time to scout other options and need the car to be safe. When I'm back I will get some snaps of the front brakes and post them on here for thoughts.

Thank you all again. I love my 4Runner and this is really the only real problem I've had with the vehicle (or the dealership) and would love to get this figured out.

 

I'm pretty sure it's standard procedure at a dealer to tell all customers their pads are bad. I once had a dealer (Honda) tell me I needed new pads when I brought in a vehicle for warranty work. Part of their multipoint upsell inspection. I enjoyed the look on the techs face when I told him I just changed them the weekend before. Dealers are crooks.

IMO 30k is not normal unless you do 100% stop/go traffic and have a heavy foot. Both of our 4runners are around 60K with plenty of pad life left. I think my tundra went over 100k on the fronts.

 

Next time, take it to another shop. If they’re not lying, my suspicion is they messed up the first repair, leading to early failure of the second set. But it’s more likely they are lying, given the other lie about this being “normal for trucks.”

 

This. Countless stories of dealers upselling brakes, fluid flushes, etc. when they are not needed.

 

I will say this in defense of my local Toyota dealership's service department: they don't always try to upsell me on stuff, especially my regular advisor. Regarding my brakes, I've been to that dealership for every oil change (I know, I used to do them myself, but I'm not so eager to crawl around under the truck these days). At those visits, they always told me the pad thickness front and rear, and they didn't lie. As I mentioned earlier, I just replaced my front pads at 117k miles. They had told me at 115k that the pad thickness on those was 2mm. When I took them off, the thinnest one was that thick.

So while it's easy to generalize dealerships and bash the whole group, I've found that developing a working relationship with a service advisor eliminates most of that. They do get paid based on the extra services they sell, and they do have families, so they gotta do what they gotta do. Getting to know your service and parts guys goes a long way.

 

Same here. Every time I take in my Outback, the report lists the measurement on each pad with comparison to the recommended replacement threshold. I wouldn't listen to anyone who lacked the data to back their recommendation.

 

Generalization is bad, responding to a specific problem is not. I would have a really hard time believing an advisor that sold work under cirmustances that don’t make sense, by presenting “evidence” that doesn’t make sense (like all trucks eat brakes).

I know service advisors gotta eat. So does everyone else. To avoid all out war, societies generally agree to, and enforce some ground rules, like don’t steal, don’t defraud, etc.

Just because it’s hard to enforce these things in the context of mechanics or other services that require specialized knowledge, doesn’t mean it’s ok to defraud. If it looks like you’re getting lied to, you have to move your business to the next guy.

 

Rotors can be machined. They are liars

 

I have a 2020 limited and I replaced mine at 20000. I went with aftermarket. The dealership started making notes about 16000. I don’t know they r doing ok now have 60000

 

Have them show you with wheels off. If they are going to replace everything, wait until you hear metal grinding and ask for old parts. Just doesn't sound right too me.

 

I replaced my front pads @30,000 miles. They were @4mm or 20%. I’m in New England as well.
Our rotors are hard to resurface if the machine does not have the proper size cone to fit the hub bore. Probably why they don’t turn them.
Have the shop bring you out and show you the measurement with the tool they are using to measure the pads. You can have them compare new pad to old. If they will not show you then leave.