Going from KDSS to not having it. Anyone done it?

I have another thread here about my recently totaled '23 ORP. I had KDSS on that rig, and if I'm lucky enough to find a replacement at this stage of the game it probably won't have it. Has anyone here gone from having it to not having it? It's hard to get a feel from just a test drive, but when I drove them back to back last year I had to have the KDSS!

Anyone with experience with this? I'd love to hear some thoughts.

 

Here in Canada, all OR's are premium with KDSS. I knew I would be going to an OR because of the features, but enjoyed the ride over the SR5 I test drove. If I had a model without it, I would at least upgrade the suspension. I can imagine a non-KDSS model would drive very nicely with a good suspension upgrade.

 

I had opposite experience I drove SR5 without KDSS and my new truck was TRD Off-road with KDSS. In my opinion KDSS gives you firmer ride with a little less nose dive on firm braking and way less lean on turns. So I think you'll have to take turns slower and other than that if new non-KDSS ride will be too soft you can increase tire pressure. Or upgrade suspension - I saw some people do it, but I got used to stock suspension. Personally I wouldn't care much about KDSS, I was happily driving without it for long time, but everybody has his own preferences.

 

I went from a Venture with NO KDSS to an ORP WITH KDSS. Night and day difference: less lurch on braking, less lean on corners, more stability on the highway (less wandering).

 

I have a 2011 with KDSS and a 2018 without KDSS. The ride in the 2011 is a lot firmer than the ride in the 2018. I like the ride of the 2018 better.

 

Yep, I have KDSS but prefer the ride of non KDSS for this reason.

 

Not to burst anyone's bubble, but KDSS has zero effect on nosedive.

KDSS only affects side to side sway and off-road articulation.

There are actually some benefits to not having KDSS, one of which being one less potential failure point, and another being no concerns about limitations with aftermarket suspension.

A decent aftermarket suspension will help a lot with the mushy handling.

I think KDSS is awesome, but I would not let it be a deal-breaker from me buying another 4Runner if I totaled this one.

 

I know that KDSS shouldn't affect nosedive, but subjective feeling is that there's less nosedive with KDSS : )

 

I took a good long drive in a used one today that didn't have it. I think I could live without it. It was definitely mushy, but I am not really driving it like a sports car. I haven't driven one without it off road, so I am curious as to the difference there.

 

Definitely agree with this.

 

I wonder if there is more rotational resistance on the bushings due to the size of the bar. That’s they only thing I can imagine would cause a difference related to nose dive.

 

Agree with everything said thus far - we've had 4Runners with KDSS but my latest one does not. I love the firmness and reduced body roll it offers, but lacking it would not deter me from buying. Our GX has KDSS and the pistons both have a little hydraulic juice on the boot. Going without KDSS is definitely nice in that you have one less thing to worry about.

 

I had kdss and specifically got a non kdss as my current rig

the kdss one on windy roads does have less body roll you can tell the difference at first but then you forget about it

off-roading honestly I could not tell the difference at all and kdss doesn’t work if you’re going over 10mph (or around that speed I forget exactly)

dr kdss makes a kdss switch kit where you can press it and it will let you turn it off at any speed and the guy is my neighbor ironically so I got one from him super nice guy but his batch of switches he got from the factory were defective, he was nice enough to install it and he gave me my money back obviously. I heard nothing but good things about his product but since I never actually used it I can’t comment on it personally

the reason I purposely did not get kdss is it’s another failure point. I did a trip to Utah when I first got the rig and it had maybe 2 or 3k miles on the odometer when I got home I cleaned the underside since some trails were a little muddy since it rained out there (I do not do any muddling whatsoever I purposely avoid it) anyway I removed the kdss accumulator skid plate and I was pretty suprised the wires are actually pretty exposed and they and the entire unit was covered in mud

I cleaned it off no big deal but it’s just a poor design on the 4Runner vs the ones on the Land Cruiser/lexus and if I never cleaned it like 99percent of the people who have it, the wires would have corroded and I would have gotten a leak or failure, I live in SoCal and I’m so anal about these things I even called all the Toyota dealers and none of them had the machine you need to fix a hydraulic leak I only found one Lexus dealer in the entire SoCal region who said they had the machine

as far as driving differences like I said the kdss was a little more planted on super windy roads but its not like I got this car to behave like a sports car and also no Tacoma or tundra ever had kdss. If I were to get another 4Runner tomorrow I would specifically got a non kdss one again for the above mentioned reasons.

plus when I lifted my kdss one I did have the kdss lean I even ordered the spacer for it but sold the rig before installing it. Off roading I did not notice any articulation advantage at all with kdss and I took that thing out to Moab

 

That is awesome feedback. Thank you!

 

My daughter had an SR5 for a while and I had time enough behind the wheel to compare it to my ORP with KDSS. The ORP is more fun to drive on the road. More spritely, if the term “spritely” can be applied to the 4Runner. Off road they are the same aside from the rear locker, and the ORP’s MTS gizmos which I mostly ignore. If I had an SR5 I’d add an aftermarket rear locker.

As far as avoiding KDSS because it adds another failure point: the 5th gen, especially post 2019, is so crammed full of nanny b.s. and comfort b.s. that the thought of avoiding KDSS because it’s one more drop in an ocean of potential failure points is laughable. If we’re going to start worrying about failure points, the 5th gen is the wrong vehicle altogether.

 

Exactly. Any feature that requires inspection and/or maintenance is a potential failure point. One can actually do something about preventing KDSS issues. Electronic nannies? Nothing one can do about those if they go south, short of a trip to the dealer.

There'll always be those for and against KDSS.

 

Add to that any feature that adds parts.

 

If you go on t4r (the other 4Runner forum) the issue is there are a plethora of kdss leaks and failures and it is extremely costly for them to repair so it’s not even a “hypothetical” but there are pages of pages of guys who experienced leaks where you have to bleed and refill the entire system

 

I'm not sure what pages of pages are but if you mean pages and pages that's a bit of an exaggeration. There are several reports of leaks and failures indeed costing a lot to repair but not a plethora.

 

I guess this is the opposite of what you're asking, so maybe it's not helpful.

I went from non-KDSS to KDSS. I specifically spec'd a vehicle with KDSS after owning a non-KDSS version.

 

Even you see them on other 4Runner and GX forums or FB KDSS groups don't mention it here.

 

Here in Texas it's damn near impossible to find a KDSS 4R... All the ORP's allocated to dealerships locally ship without KDSS.

That said, I bought the ORP for the locker, and didn't want KDSS. Eventually as I got more serious about wheeling I just removed the front sway bar entirely and I have more articulation than my buddies with KDSS. Off road it's amazing and on road the Dobinsons IMS shocks keep body roll in check quite nicely.

It's all about your end goal. If you're going to build a 4Runner KDSS probably isn't the move imo. But if you want to keep it stock KDSS is awesome.

They're both very capable though so I wouldn't let KDSS dictate my decision on buying one or not.