Release delayed lol

My 2024 4R ORP came with Bridgestone Dueler H/T

 

That’s what my 2017 came with. Terrible on anything but dry highways.

 

My '19 also. Just seems counterintuitive to deliver an off road package with HT tires. It was bad enough in the early 2000s when the TRD packages would be delivered with Goodrich "Trail" TA and all the magazines would describe them as "beefy off road tires". It would make me chuckle.

 

On the other hand, how many people agree on what specific tires to use? Whatever AT tires they chose for OEM, 2/3 of buyers would complain that it was the wrong one if the dozens of tire threads here are any indication. They might as well keep the price down and let buyers choose their own.

 

Ok. I hear you. But then that stated approach pretty much ensures that everybody dislikes them. And the Bridgestones are not inexpensive. At least not to the general buying public.

 

You can bet the cheap ass OEM Bridgestone and Dunlop tires are cheap to Toyota, that's why they use them.

 

Light, low rolling resistance (both for fuel efficiency) and low road noise. I think that's what they went for.

Life's too short to drive on either one of them. I replaced my Dunlops on the way home from the dealership with 7 miles on the odometer.

 

Ppl over estimate tire needs.. plenty evidence of peole wheeling the shit out of the stock dueler tires in Moab and other situations…

yes the ceiling for offroad performance is lower with the HT duelers, compared to the ATs. however people have zero reference on what that ceiling is and assume it’s at the forest road level.

then the same mindset is spread around like gospel.. “went from dealer straight to the tire shoppe!” Lol

 

Sorta agree. The Bridgestones were really nice on the road but slipped at even a hint of dust/dirt. Had some Dunlops on my old truck as "temporary get me by tires" and they were really pretty good.

 

Depends on where you travel. Neither of the stock tire options stand a chance in hell of surviving the sharp rocks where I live.

Moab is a lot of smooth rock.

 

If Jeep can put decent tires on their off-road models then Toyota can too. They’re just being cheap skates.

 

And a real 2 speed transfer case. I don't know if the 1st gear on the AWD vehicles are low enough these days, but nothing beats a true locked Front to Rear 2 speed transfer case in long term durability.

 

The fact that they refuse to put dusk sensing headlights on 50+k ORPs tells me you are right on the money.

 

The Dunlops are passable tires, in my opinion. I ran them down on both my Tacoma and 4Runner, but they were not the best in slippery conditions (including simply wet roads). I was thinking light mud when I imagined someone getting stuck with the stock tires, they're basically slick street tires. Tread depth and siping are both lacking compared to many options out there.

That said, my Rav4 also comes with a Grandtrek flavor as well (P20 or something, highway tire). I'll run them down as well, but just because I'm willing to live with the limitations. If there is heavy rain or similar in the forecast, I take the 4Runner, because I chose those tires.

 

That’s great but why does a vehicle called a TRD Off Road come with street tires in the first place?

 

This was my reason for replacing, bought the 4runner in Reno and drove home to Sacramento in a blizzard that night, went through 6-8 inches of snow before the plows made their way through. I made it fine, but wanted something better in the snow being that I frequent Tahoe/Reno and over the Sierras many times each winter.

 

The front solid axle of the Jeep allows for articulation that the 4Runner or other awd cars can’t match. This allows it to maintain traction in various types of terrain. In other words, by not losing traction to begin with, it wouldn’t need to rely on traction aids until things get much more gnarly. Where as 4Runners and other awd vehicles depend on clutch packs, viscous couplings, brakes, etc. for nearly every obstacle. It’s not a small detail, as it lets the Jeep travel on difficult terrain all day, every day, without really taxing anything at all. All of that being said, the 4Runner does pretty good, and most people don't take their Subaru...I mean 4Runner, on difficult roads/trails anyway, so the nicer ride of the Subaru...I mean 4Runner, is really what it's all about anyway.

I've had a Subaru and a 4Runner and the Subaru is just like a 4Runner, when compared to an off road vehicle. The Subaru will go 90% of the places a 4Runner will, but it will do it in more comfort 100% of the time. A 4Runner will go 80% of the places a Jeep (Wrangler) will go, but will do it in more comfort 100% of the time. The reality, almost all 4Runner owners will be as well, or better, served with a Subaru. The 4Runner is "cooler" than the Subaru though, and that's why most of us buy a vehicle, because it meets the cool factor.

 

Agreed, even the OR Taco's got the slight upgrade in tires.

I still shake my head at the carpet TRD floormats, like who thought that was a good idea? What 4wd anything ever needs carpet floormats?

 

It's not recent. It's always been the case, but as they have had to deal with more stuck or broken down vehicles, they have chosen to enforce what's already been on the books for decades (at least since the 1980s).

To the point about tires. The manufacturers, Toyota in this case, provide the lowest cost tire that meets the marketing need. Jeep is branded and marketed as, and in fact is, the most off road capable out of the box vehicle you can buy. Toyota 4Runner are not. They are mostly a "sport utility vehicle" and the equipment they come with reflect that.

Traction is the most important thing you need off road. That starts with tires. Yes, some vehicle do well with stock "highway" tires, but that's only because they still maintain traction. When the traction is reduced, those tires fail immediately and so does the movement of the vehicle. The National Park Service (NPS) has had high-clearance, 4x4, signs posted for decades. People have decided to see how far they can take their "cars" and there are more instances of having to provide recovery. The NPS has decided to enforce the already existing rules, that's all.

 

Oh man, why can't we have this in the US??

https://www.toyota.com.au/landcruiser-70

 

Because almost no one would buy them.

 

That’s pretty nice. For some reason manufacturers think that all Americans want luxury trucks that cost a fortune.

 

Really. I would buy one. Look how many people drive Gladiators.

 

Probably because it's mostly true. I would like a bare-bones type LC, but for every one of me, there are hundreds or thousands who no likey.

 

'xactly. Now, look at how many people drive diesel Gladiators. Now look at Gladiator sales figures, incentives and rebates.

 

That's only a part of it. There is zero chance it will be allowed to be sold under federal FMVSS, CAFE, and emissions regulations, and you would not believe how expensive crash testing is, meaning low volume specialty vehicles that are not 300k+ exotics are exceedingly difficult to sell here.

 

Yes, I would. But, you're right.

 

My Acuras with SH-AWD were far superior in moderate snow and ice to any Subaru we’ve ever owned. Subaru’s symmetrical AWD system is average at best and the drivetrains are fragile. We had 2 major motor repairs on our Subies and that was enough for me. I’d never buy one again, and when the snow got deep the Subaru would be parked for a few days at a time anyway. Our 4R (even our SR5-P) and Tundras walk right through the deep snow without any drama. My old Wranglers (and my last Rubicon) were great too. The FT 4WD system in the Limited is the best I’ve experienced. I’ve been in bumper deep snow, heavy mud, icy hilly roads, and everything in between. I see a ton of 4R every day, it’s like they’re purpose built for my climate and topography.

 

Yep, I'm doing a quick scroll down the website and I'm blown away that things like a collapsible steering column, standard A/C and an engine immobilizer are headlining features in a brand-new vehicle in a "first-world country" that starts at $75,600 AUD or ~$51k+ USD.

(but there might be differences between the countries in what that sticker price includes)

At that price, the usual buyer is going to compare that with an upper-trim 2024 4Runner or add a few grand and get a '24 TRD Pro or a base Land Cruiser 1958. (assuming minimal deviation from MSRP)

Solid front axle fans already have the Wrangler and a selection of HD pickups too. Toyota already swapped out the tougher HiLux for a bit more comfy Tacoma for US/Canada 30 years ago.

Although, we can't take an immobilizer for granted anymore thanks to Hyundai and Kia.

 

Really? A solid rear axle doesn’t give the 4runner significant advantages for off road use? What about the advantages of a factory mechanical locker?

If these things do provide significant advantages off road, then subaru’s and 4runners cannot be just like each other compared to off road vehicles.

Like you mentioned, the Jeep’s front and rear solid axles give it a significant advantage over the 4runner in many off road situations, which is why a 4runner is not the same as a Jeep off road.

Maybe the point of your post is that most people don’t need what they think they need. Which is true. But that’s a separate topic.

Speaking of which, I just realized the topic of Subarus vs 4runners is off topic as well. Sorry for the thread derailment lol.