2024 Landcruiser Engine Performance

Like my old 4R…..116 hp and 3,800# which I love anyway, 0-60 is ‘eventually’.
Comparatively the 22 feels like a hot rod.

 

My 2003 4runner is considerably quicker than my 2023.

 

Neither, at this point. I thought that, with the price being so much closer to the 4Runner than it has been with other recent Landcruisers, I'd probably get a LC if I were going to buy something. But, I'm just not in love with it. I thought the drivetrain was nice. But, the rest of it really didn't do much for me.

One thing that I was disappointed with was the little baby cup holders. I don't know why manufacturers can't put a grown up sized cup holder in anything anymore. This was actually a contributing factor in my decision to go back to a 4Runner from my '15 Tacoma.

I mostly just wanted to drive one myself, to get my own opinion. It seems like people expect sports car acceleration, which will never be the case. I thought it had plenty of power.

Haha! I had a '94 with the 3.0, which wasn't much better than the 22R. Passing wasn't even an option, most of the time.

Which motor is in the '03? My '03 felt quicker off the line than my '19. But, the 5th gen is actually quicker to 60, and in the 1/4 mile, regardless of which engine you have.

 

Isn't it a throttle mapping thing? Like the 5th gen you have to push the pedal much further, while the 4th gen feels like it has more punch off idle?

 

That could definitely be a factor. My '03 seemed more peppy. But, I figured it was due to the torque. You definitely have to have a heavy foot with the 5th gen.

 

~30yrs ago I was giving my boss a ride home on a +90 degree day and when we were going up the Altamont Pass I had to down shift to 4th and turn off the AC to keep up with traffic. My boss obviously noticed the lack of AC and asked me why I turned it off. I told him I needed the extra 20 HP, He replied “what’s next, the radio?”
He is blown away I’ve kept it this long and we still chuckle about it.

 

I recently had a chance to sit in a new LC and start it up. Sounded like a little 4 banger. Did NOT sound like a "truck". The 5th gen roars in comparison (volume).

It wasn't offensive. It was pleasant. Just seemed odd. I've never driven a turbo.

 

People say that, but all the sites I’ve looked at for 0-60 and 1/4-mile times for the V8 and Gen5 have them within a few tenths of a second of each other.

 

You are correct. The 5th gen is actually a little quicker than the earlier V8 4runners. The later V8 4Runners might be a bit quicker, though. If I recall correctly, around 2005 the V8 gained around 30 or 40 horsepower.

 

I have a 2008 Urban Runner 4R with the 4.0 v6 and it feels like an animal compared to our 2012 Limited and 2023 TRD Sport. Its considerably stronger, considerably better throttle response, other worldly better engine and trans tuning, and somehow gets the same fuel mileage. Its so much more "peppy" and pulls a trailer WAY WAY WAY better and doesnt hunt for gears while driving the interstate and cruise control is actually usable. My 2023 TRD Sport cruise is completely useless. I bet i have less than 6 miles combined of cruise control, its completely, absolutely, unusable. The trans wont stay in a gear, its downshifting 2-3 gears and screaming 5500RPM when the wind blows, not even on a hill.

 

Yeah, for all the complaining about how noisy this engine is, from myself even, there is something satisfying about the roar when you start it up.

Based on my test drive of a Tacoma earlier this year, the extra grunt from the turbo did make it satisfying to drive, though.

 

It's interesting how an engine with less power can feel more powerful. I wonder what the gearing is on the V6 4th gen 4Runners. I'm convinced that the granny gears in the fifth gen are part of the problem. I guess a few hundred extra pounds, and what looks to be a less aerodynamic design isn't doing it any favors, either.

 

I "think" the 2023 TRD Sport is 3.73 and i "believe" my 2008 is 4.10

 

That sounds about right. I'm sure that difference in gearing is a big part of the difference in the performance.

 

For example, i own a 2006 Tundra Double Cab with the 2UZ-FE v8 which has the VVTi ect ect, all the bells and whistles. I bought it to tow with because the 2008 4runner squats a bit much when towing. Now, after owning the tundra a few years, i think it tows as good or better than the v8 Tundra. Any short trips, or stuff that i dont have to haul a bunch of gear, i pick the 2008 4Runner to pull with. I needed to drive 5+ hours to pick up a machine back in March and i thought LONG and HARD about which vehicle to take and it came down to fuel mileage and fuel stops that made me take the Tundra. Where i needed to fuel up with the 4Runner was going to be a dead spot with no stations, and having to stop early would have caused me to make a whole additional fuel stop on the journey (time) so i took the Tundra and was able to get away with only 2 fuel stops rather than 3. 18gal tank vs 22gal tank and both get 16mpg. However on the way back towing the machine, i kinda wished a few times i had the 4Runner.
It feels so much stronger and better than you can imagine, i honestly prefer it towing over the v8 Tundra.

 

I say i "believe" the 2008 is 4.10, because i recall looking thru gearing on the older 4R and i recall seeing that certain models were as low as like 4.33 or something.
They had to have made it up in the trans gearing, because pretty much everything runs 2000RPM at cruising speeds.

 

I think everything can be explained with size and weight, every generation of 4runner is bigger than the last.

The 6th gen T4R and LC250 is no exception. I think they gain a foot in length and an inch in width. My biggest complaint of both these new models is the full size dimensions.

The listed fuel efficiency is only slightly better than what I get with my 3rd gen I4 which was designed over 30 years ago.

The power is better, but the fact both the 6th gen 4R and LC are now full sized SUV any gain in speed was cancelled out almost entirely.

I have beat this drum a long time, every time the size increases the 4runner becomes worse off road and less reliable. From a geometry perspective the 3rd gen was the best thanks to low over hangs and the highest ground clearance ever. But I struggle to imagine the 6th gen not having issues fitting through trails, the 5th gen looks nimble in comparison. The more weight, the more engine complexity is needed to move it around while still meeting efficiency requirements. This also leads to higher price tags too.

We shouldn’t ignore this erosion of capability, it will add up.

Notice how Toyota drowned out the release with the Trail Hunter and TRD, they do this to nudge us away from the fact that the foundation is worse.

 

People insist that the V8 4Runners accelerate far quicker than the V6 5th Gen’s but data > opinion. Similarly, the new Landcruiser is in fact accelerating slower than the 5th Gen 4Runner and yet people insist it’s “powerful and feels so much faster”. A Honda S2000 was relatively quick back in the day but didn’t feel it, because it was peaky and lacked torque. The current LC seems to be the opposite where some people say it feels so strong and yet the data doesn’t support that “feel”, likely because of the weight and the inability to just add up gas motor output to electric motor output in this configuration and say it’s got 326HP and 465 LBS ft of torque. This is evident in the GX550 having basically very same weight and engine output in theory but putting down vastly quicker acceleration figures in real world.

Also, having owned a 2015 4Runner and now a 2023, I recalled their previous EPA sticker MPG rating being higher in the past than the latest model years and yet we all know the engine and transmission hasn’t changed in the 4Runners since 2010. The EPA modifies its testing and manufacturers figure out how to “game” or back into favorable figures with an understanding of how they’re testing which doesn’t really simulate real world driving. Nothing about the 5th Gen 4Runners powertrain has changed yet the EPA estimates have come down meaningfully since the engineers weren’t able to implement a way to game the latest testing conditions. The experienced fuel economy of actual drivers of the turbo boosted hybrid 4 has been falling 2-3 MPGs short in city and highway. This is not my opinion, it’s data. I suspect (my opinion) due to the 2.4 having to access a decent amount of boost in real world driving to move the LC which necessarily means it’s using much more air and fuel (synthetic displacement) akin to a much larger naturally aspirated engine. I’m still perplexed because the electric motor should be offering more relief but they went with a lower tech battery design and erred on the side of reliability and less cost but got less electric assist too.

The other tough part is that the new LC has a gas tank that reflects a car getting 23-24 MPGs consistently (17.9 gallons) but if you’re getting closer to 18-19 on a blended basis the range is really bad. The latest Motor Trend test said they were getting 16 MPGs similar to the GX550s.

 

98.4% of owners will never go offroad, like not even a gravel road.
Toyota wants the allure of offroad capability, but they want on-road luxury and amenities because that is what makes people buy vehicles. VERY VERY few people go to a Toyota dealership and say "this 4runner is the best offroad vehicle and would fit my needs the best" because honestly any serious offroader would go to a Toyota dealership and say "this thing sucks from an offroad perspective, where is the closed Jeep dealership"
Sure people are starting this overland trend and sticking bells and whistles on vehicles and calling them offroaders. Some are actually hitting trails with them, but i can pretty much guarantee its 98+% of Toyota 4runners will never see anything past a short gravel road.
The newest version is no different, they want to make it LOOK like you can go anywhere because Ford has tried to do the same with the new Bronco, and truthfully they have a platform with a lot of "bling" and "eye candy" and it can go offroad. Tons and tons of stuff, aftermarket add-ons, plenty of storage ect, make it a vehicle many people want. Toyota is pushing for this offroad TrailHunter edition which is a way to try to appeal to a very small market of people who want the "bling" of offroad. I would bet 75% of the TrailHunters sold will never ever see anything past a short gravel road. Can it do it, yes. Will it do it, no.
Toyota is trying to build reliability, and with marketing, they figure out what people want and try to build that with reliability and profitability. If you want a specific offroad vehicle for serious offroading go buy a Can-am Maverick X3 or a Polaris RZR. These are offroad vehicles specifically marketed and built to handle jumps, bumps, whoops, climbs, ect ect. Dont expect Toyota to build you a specific offroader, you should use your Toyota to haul a trailer with the offroader if you want something thats serious for offroading.

 

From what I can tell, it accelerates about the same as the 5th gen.

I'll admit that I have not read all that much about the new Landcruiser. But, where are people saying that it feels "so much faster" than the 5th gen 4runner?

 

Imagine a company sells 2 things: spheres and cubes. 80% of the market prefers spheres and 20% prefer cubes. One day there is a cube craze and a lot of sphere buyers get cubes. But these new owners complain how this cube is not enough like the sphere they had before, so the company rounds the corners of the cube, and even more sphere buyers purchase it because it's more like a sphere they liked, and this continues until the company ends up selling 2 nearly identical products. The cube is the 4runner

Of course Toyota will sell more 4runners if they keep making it less like a 4x4 and more like a mass appeal vehicle. That's what most people want, but Toyota already makes a vehicle for most people and it's called the Highlander. The reason Toyota can sell 100k+ 4runners a year is that people would rather buy a vehicle that's worse for them if it's cool and different. If you remove the things about the 4runner that are cool and different you turn it into the thing people were trying to escape.

People use to cross shop the pathfinder and the 4runner until Nissan fell victim to this phenomenon and made the Pathfinder too much like a mass market SUV. This is why saying "they don't go off road, who cares?" is wrong. Who cares is everyone who purchased the last generation.

If this "they want luxury" thing is true then they can buy the Land Cruiser. If you go to Asspen you see an the rich city slickers driving around in LC60 even though they aren't luxurious. They do it because they think it's cool.

 

The sites are wrong. I lined 'em up side by side...The 2003 V6 (with 250K miles on it) will flat smoke my 2023

It's the wife's car...she doesn't mind slow....the important thing is that it's blue, which makes her happy lol.

 

I tried flat footing the 2023...still a dog. Its a different engine (the heads/valvetrain at least) with more strict CAFE standards to meet....it makes sense that it's tuned this way...most newer trucks seem to be.

 

So, you're saying that car and driver does not know how to test for a 0 to 60 time?


Aside from that, my 2015 Tacoma had the same V6 as your older 4Runner. And, when my 4Runner was stock, it would have run circles around that Tacoma.

Yes, it is a different engine. It's a newer version of the same engine with 40 more horsepower.

Off the line it probably feels more sluggish because of gearing.

 

I don't know what to tell you. My 03 was fun to drive, the 23 is boring and slow.

 

I agree 113%
2008 urban runner with 285/65-18 LRE
VS
2012 limited with 285/55-20
VS
2023 TRD Sport with 305/50-20

2008 smokes the other two handily. In every metric. I think the 2023 MIGHT brake a little better. But a few more miles of my wife behind the wheel and the brakes are going to be warped then the 2008 will certainly stop better.

 

I don't have any empirical data, but I don't remember ever feeling like my 2003 v8 or my 2007 v6 was slow or sluggish. OTOH, I do feel that way sometimes with my 2024, and my 2020 felt the same as my 2024.

 

Huh? Only judging the startup sound?

You know the 4.0L’s startup sound is mostly the radiator fan?

 

I guess the butt dyno is superior to actual data.