6th gen Speculation Thread

Idk man, bass guy is pretty laxed

 

Oh, I'm steaming over here.

Edit: I've admitted that I know it's not rational. I just find it extremely disappointing that my dream car finally came back, but as a rebadged BMW. I'll never own one of the new ones, so it doesn't really matter. But, the fact that I would now rather have a Nissan Z than a Toyota Supra says a lot to me.

Just because others don't mind isn't going to change my opinion.



Sorry for going off topic... Again.

 

Maybe there's some bong water spilled on the shag rug. Better check.

I loved the first gen Supra -- not the Celica / Supra but the true first gen which was a wonderful car. That inline six was buttery smooth. The collaboration with BMW makes obvious economic sense, but the new Supra is a BMW with Toyota stamped sheetmetal on it. It's made in Austria on the same assembly line as the BMW Z4. It's the same car. Hey, it could be worse, it could be made in Mexico, China or the USA. Austria is not so bad. I've had some pretty good sausages there and the beer isn't bad either.

Some people don't care. Some people drive Buicks. I met a woman once who had a wooden leg and left it at a train station in Spain only to get a ticket for littering.

 

Totally get it, not criticizing anyone for feeling that way. I just like good engines, regardless of who made them. Not all of them belong in every car though!

 

I 100% agree that the new Supra is not a true replacement for the A70 or A80 platform and is an actual insult to the name. The A90 is just an over-tuned Z4 with a few Toyota bits thrown on. I owned an MKIV Supra for 9 years and it was an absolute dream to drive. It was an analog beast that required tons of input from the driver. It was a timeless body design that the new gen just missed out on. Ok, rant over. Sorry, to keep this off topic.

 

So if the photo is of a 70, it really does not mean much, multiple reasons.

1) Manufactures test new models against existing models.

2) Manufactures use the body of an older model on top of the frame of the new model to create "test mules" in order to test in plain site.

3) The publisher used a blurry photo of a 70 as a stand-in for the model being tested.

Here is a Ford Bronco test mule.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a27795091/weird-ford-f-150-raptor-test-mule/

 

Staying off topic to address some misinformation about the MkV Supra, here's a video which does a good job explaining the Toyota/BMW collaboration which produced the new Supra and Z4. Facts starting at 5:56:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jbyzmtgU_0&t=356s

• New front engine, real-wheel drive platform co-developed by Toyota and BMW, with focuses on:
  • Rigidity to handle both coupe and convertible variants
  • 50:50 weight distribution
  • Vehicle agility
• Teams agreed upon chassis details such as:
  • frame structure
  • wheelbase
  • track width
  • suspension
• BMW makes inline 6 turbo engines, Toyota didn't anymore:
  • BMW's N55 did not meet Toyota's reliability standards
  • BMW started work on the B-engine platform at roughly the same time the collaboration began
  • Toyota's engineers contributed to the development of the B58 engine as part of the Supra collaboration
• The platform's suspension drew heavily from BMW's existing parts bin:
  • Both teams liked the characteristics of the then-current M cars
  • Lower development and production costs
• Magna Steyr was chosen as the manufacturer due to:
  • Access to existing BMW supply chain
  • 3rd-party manufacturer enabled each company to tailor the build process for their own products
• Toyota and BMW went their separate ways after collaborating on the platform
  • Exterior design, interior design, drivetrain and suspension tuning was all handled independently as the companies wanted the cars to look and feel different.
  • German law prohibits badge-engineering, the most BMW was allowed to do with Toyota was collaborate on the platform itself.
  • On-road durability testing was handled by BMW with data being sent back to Toyota.

Disclosure: I have a 2020 A90 and it's a goddamned riot.

 

That B58 motor must be so much more reliable than the inline six that BMW was making prior to Toyota getting involved. That's a nice German car albeit made in Austria.

 

Wow, thanks, the 2 door looks amazing and check out the second photo, is that that 4 door photo Land Cruiser or it looks more like a 4Runner to me?

 

They thought it was more photogenic without a roof rack. Not quite as adventure-ready, though.

 

post more pics please! not on insta!

 

Here are the screen shots.

 

This is exciting, I think.
But what does it mean
are they going to offer two door and four door LC?
Or second shot is of next gen 4R?

 

The second shot is the Prado, my Plano grapevine source link was pretty close.

https://www.carsguide.com.au/car-ne...ta-landcruiser-prado-gr-sport-would-reset-the

 

The new LC is a detuned sub-GX after all with no Heritage FJ40/70 styling and no special model for the US. Ford and Jeep are breathing a huge whoosh sigh of relief. Two new near 4Runners (LC and GX) is all Toyota can muster. What a pity. Now I have to find myself a SO 4Runner fast!

 

The two-door is the old Land Cruiser; they are just trying to make the association.

 

I think that must be it.

 

The idea of stretching a Ford Flex to come up with the final design of the new LandCruiser was a brilliant stroke of genius!

 

troll much?

 

haha, I’m not as pessimistic as you are, but I am a bit confused. If the idea was for Toyota to put something out that compares more with the Bronco and Jeeps, then this prado obviously isn’t that.

Mayyybe this prado fills the toned-down GX role that the 4Runner was kinda satisfying, and the 6th gen 4Runner will be freed up to morph more into a more aggressive looking, off roading competitor for the Bronco and Rubicon?

With the new GX, and this Prado looking very much like what @TexasFunRunner was predicting, a 6th gen 4Runner that doesn’t diverge much from the 5th gen (new body + 4cyl engine, similar to the Tacoma changes) seems repetitive and awkward…

 

A troll? If you read my well thought out previous posts, you will find that, along with others here, I correctly predicted that the new LC would be a sub GX clone, there would be no Heritage FJ40/70 styling, and there would be no special model for the US. You will also find that I prayed to high heaven to be wrong. What I could not anticipate is that Toyota would take styling clues from the Ford Flex for the new LC! And I do not think anyone here imagined that possible either. I also predicted that the new 4Runner will be the Tacoma clone, made In Mexico product tasked to take on the infidel surge from Ford, Jeep et al. Check back later and see if those predictions are true as well. Cheers. (and try and get some sleep.)

 

I think everybody predicted the new US-version of the Land Cruiser would be a GX chassis, and now body apparently. I don't think anyone thought a 70-series was ever coming to the US due to emissions and crash testing rules (plus cost of low-volume production). What this means for the 4Runner is up in the air. To slot in below the GX, the new LC will need to be in the $55-70k range, not sure what features it could possibly have over the 4R to justify that cost other than the name, unless they dramatically diverge from the platform capabilities launched with the GX.

Or, the 4Runner TRD Pro = Land Cruiser, with a nice bump in margin $ for Toyota and dealers, and the rest of the 4R line is similar to the current lower and mid spec 5th gen, but with the new platform and warmed over bodywork. I wonder what pricing will look like across the board.

 

OK: The silhouette looks nothing like flex. Flex was much lower to the ground and was already pretty long. LC also sits much higher.

 

Aaaaah...it will be interesting to see how they come up with pricing here. Toyota has SUVs for everyone and this space here -- GX, LC, 4R -- is getting very crowded. There is bound to be some ... confusion ... when we get the numbers out.

Maybe their approach is -- we have SUV for every single customer so no need to go elsewhere. You want more luxurious offroader -- GX! You want name plate -- LC! You want actual off roader people will take off road -- 4R! Its essentially flood the market with multiple options, so customer just doesnt look at anything else.

Pricing likely being in that order (GX -- LC -- 4R). But...with trims etc. it would make for an interesting space. I also predict demise of sequoia and highlander. These two are way too close to other models but more inferior. Those who buy sequoia -- would rather buy GH (with so much more usable third row). Maybe there is still market for H but certainly units sold would go down, as part of H crowd will go to GH.

 

I think you may be the only one visualizing a Flex, it looks nothing like one, nor does it share any lines.

 

I’m wondering why we have teasers of GX and LC Prado but nothing about next 4Runner. Just crickets

 

Here is my running summary, a big thanks to @Carmaker1 for sharing much of the background information.

2024 Toyota Land Cruiser 250
Revealed: Aug 1, 2023
Launch: Q2 2024
Engines: i-Force MAX 2.4L Turbo I-4 Hybrid

2025 Toyota 6th gen 4Runner (Tacoma influenced)
Reveal: Q1 2024 (teasers start 4 - 6 weeks ahead of reveal)
Launch: Q3 2024
Engines: 2.4L turbo I-4, i-Force MAX 2.4T I-4 hybrid, alleged PHEV, No TTV6

Latest Rendering: Carscoops is out with a new rendering as of 7/31/2023, you can see how it corrects some of the shortcomings the CarBuzz rendering had.

Insiders said the CarBuzz rendering was close but needed, a) needs to be more angular, like the new Tacoma. b) The Tacoma headlight design is extremely similar, but 4Runner has a different curvature than the Tacoma units. c) The C-Pillar is more upright for better ease of entry and a slopped D-Pillar.

DISCLAIMER: Dates and information gathered from verified sources and is believed to be accurate at time of posting. However, all dates and information are subject to change as additional information is uncovered.

 

Also, I swear each iteration of the highlander looks more and more like a minivan. Might as well drop it the highlander fans can just get the Sienna.