Current 5th gen resale prices...

My 4Runner is still listed on the web, we are pushing a month now since I traded it.

 

The thing that most forget (including dealers) is that they already have a good $3-4k profit baked into the new car value. 3 months ago 4Runners were selling for invoice. Now its MSRP plus whatever dealer addons they can get away with.

So if they wash on the used vehicle, theyre still farther ahead than they were 3 months ago.

Watch the earnings reports, automakers and dealerships (public ones) are making an absolute killing right now.

 

Their profit numbers are up per car, but their volume numbers are down significantly.

 

Few months old, but I think it still applies.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a...lerships-had-their-most-profitable-year-ever/



Also, when you're making $300 profit on a car sale normally, and sales drop by like 50%, but you now make $3-4k profit on a car. Thats a good deal to a dealership.

Example: Sell 100 cars before= $30k profit.
Sell 50 cars now= $200k profit.

Which scenario would you rather have?

 

My buddy said every time he walks in to buy a car he feels violated. I think that is a fair statement.

It’s amazing to me even in Michigan those that get Ford, GM, or whatever the hell FCA is now how employee discounts don’t mean much.

I remember years ago comparing Ford A plan on a car my Dad was buying versus what price I could negotiate on my own. It was within $150. So all these folks say hey I got the employee discount when in fact it was the employee screw job.

 

I hear you. I already mostly live my life like that, I hardly ever go out for dinner or coffee, don't drink much, haven't wasted a bunch of money on 4Runner parts, and budget at the grocery store. Between my 401k and savings, I save close to 50% of my monthly income. I thought I was on track, but the increase in pricing keeps pushing the goalpost further and further out.

I'm not quite sure I get your point on working = patriotism, or "pansy asses that don't want to work". If you're talking about all the people that don't want to go back to shitty, low paying service industry jobs, I 100% support them, For years they've been told low pay is their own fault for not aiming higher, well now they're doing it so good for them.

The problem is that American based companies are not patriotic, they put achieving max corporate profit over everything else, such as employing Americans or paying taxes. Everything is about corporate greed and money going up to the elites, and screw the working class.

Also, on a side note, I think fast food is the new manufacturing. I don't see how standing in front of a grille making food is any different or less skilled/important than standing on an assembly line attaching one part onto a widget over and over. If anything, I'd say fast food work is harder. Yet fast food is "starter jobs for kids", while MFG jobs are thought to be "good" jobs.

 

Trail Runnah,

I agree a lot of it is corporate greed for sure and American executives pushing many under the bus. In my opinion American execs continuing to business in China have American blood on their hands now with this Covid had played out.

As for the pansy asses I mentioned well where I am at anyway I see a lot of jobs not fast food that people don’t want to do. As an example up here if you want a new roof well Americans are not the one doing the labor. Those laying blacktop or concrete on freeways or residential not American. Those working in hotels cleaning rooms or other services not Americans. I respect every occupation, not all of us are built to be doctors, rocket scientist etal. But what irks me is when I see all these people asking for handouts at a traffic light when there are help wanted signs everywhere.

America was built on hard work both physical labor and know how labor. I am no more important than the guy who picks up my trash each week or the doctor that runs my tests.

It not just manual labor jobs shipped overseas either. In accounting companies in India oversee accounts receivable and payables and have for

years . People in India also do Americans tax returns as well.

I am dating a hospital administrator and hospitals are now outsourcing the responsibility of those overseeing patients with heart monitors to the Philippines. If someone’s monitor goes off someone from overseas calls pages the nurse and says Joe is in cardiac arrest wtf.

So you’re right most of it is corporate greed. But I am the guy that if without a job would take any job and have done so years ago. That’s just my opinion. I am not going to sit at a light and beg people. I am going to get off my duff and do what I have to.

I lost my job years ago in a bad economy and with a college degree I did roofing to make ends meet. Did it suck, yeah it’s tough work but it makes man out of you and we do what we need to do. That’s just my opinion.

American executives are always going to look outside also. People don’t realize the US is one of the highest taxes countries in the world. So why would you not want to outsource and set your facilities up outside. So can’t blame the exec either. They need to make shareholders happy.

Meanwhile while large corporations set up shop in places all over the globe and shift money around like a shell game and its legal.

If our country was smart we would lower our tax rates and encourage growth within the USA and then the execs would set up shop here and employee more Americans. This would encourage these American execs to be patriotic and would be a win/win situation

 

Ok, just saying there’s a new pro there now for $52k…

 

I was down the street so I went to take a look, they want 15k over msrp lol!

 

Well call me the oddball, but I waited 3 months to get my 2021 Lunar Pro, and it ticks off so many desirables for me I won't sell no matter what. There's just nothing like it out there to move to.

 

I was at the Toyota dealer for an oil change a couple weeks ago .
No one asked me if I would sell back my 4 runner. (I have a bone stock SR5.)
I guess Toyota knows there is not eneough money to be made ?
They want the TRDPRO for maximum profit!
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

The Toyota dealer I bought my 2021 TRD/ORP/SR has a 2019 SR5 BASE with 15K miles. They are asking $43,800 !!! I paid $1,000.00 less for my new one 3 months ago. LOL

 

I looked up mine again, and got offered new MSRP, which is ~$4K more than I paid 2.5 years and 58K miles ago. As much as I love this thing, it sure would be nice to have it paid off and a bunch of cash in my hand. I'm not selling it, but man this is crazy.

It's not a waste if you use it.

 

If you use it and enjoy it why sell it? Just keep and get another 20+ years of trail use out of it.

 

Agreed. I'm just saying I can see how the wheels get turning. If I were having financial issues, I would sell.

 

Or, trade it, and enjoy the 22.5 years on the new one.

 

I live in Rhode Island, "using it" is really just driving back and forth to work. If lived in an area where I didn't have to drive hundreds of miles in order to get to any off-road trails I probably would be more inclined to mod it. I already feel like I have enough money tied up in it without thousands in mods, haha.

I know you want to keep yours, but here's something to think about: If somebody put that amount of cash on the table in front of you, would you spend it on this vehicle again?

 

I know the question wasn’t directed at me but the answer would still remain… Yes. My reason might be different then your reason or anyone else’s. I take my family outdoors, we go to places not many people can go and I found while the stock 4Runner is capable for most things, at times it prevents me from taking trails that I would want to take with my family. I spent each penny as wisely as I could and with the intention of having the vehicle for the next 20+ years so I would enjoy the heck out of it. Take my boys on camping trips (not a campsite with bathrooms), go to places that might have trees that came down and would require a winch, go to places that hopefully I never get stuck but if I do I could hopefully get myself out or have the tools to get out. Allow me to meet with new people that share that same enjoyment of going off-roading/overlanding. So if I would do everything over again I would say yes… Mainly because you can’t put a price on memories that you get to make with the ones you love.

 

Yeah, I have to drive a bit to get to trails as well. But, at least there's plenty of mall crawler shows nearby.

But, I get what you're saying. The 4Runner, in stock form, is plenty capable for what many of us do with them. It wasn't until I got real skids that I finally tried some more difficult obstacles.

I suppose it doesn't make sense to spend a lot on modifications if you really won't use them. Then again, folks build sports cars all the time that they never really get to fully utilize.

One could argue that any hobby, or form of entertainment, is a waste of money. But, in my opinion, you might as well enjoy life. I get the idea of saving for retirement, etc. There should be a balance.

To your question: that is an interesting and difficult one. And, my answer might be different depending on my mood.

If you're saying just what I spent on the 4Runner, the answer is probably yes. If you're including mod money, part of me thinks I would get something more practical, and an FJ80 to modify. It's not that I don't love the 4Runner, it's just that the FJ80 is a better platform in some ways.

 

Well said!

That is basically my reasoning for travelling and modifying the 4runner. Good times are worth spending money on!

 

Exactly can’t put a price on memories and time with family.

I bought mine just recently to fish with my Dad who is almost 80. Sadly he is really having back issues since I got it but he says hey let’s go for a ride in it as I try to get my 500 miles

I am hopeful to at least pick up my boat for a few weeks this summer and drain the old gas.

I have seen so many people age, die and get health issues during the last year that’s why I got mine. I tease my Dad now hey don’t get sick on me I got this for us to go fishing and take some trips.

I think the key is to give encouragement, there is nothing wrong with some optimism.

Life and saving/spending is all a balance.

There is a old song by Louis Prima I believe “Enjoy Yourself it’s later than you Think”

We should all be so wise to listen carefully


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kisr3daNRx0

 

I watched my dad work his ass off, I basically never saw him, unless he was waking up to go to work, or coming home and going to bed after work. Well after probably 25 years at the last dept. he got fired over something he said and lost all his retirement and what not. He picked up and started a new job that paid his bills. Then he got sick and couldn’t work and basically had nothing. Needless to say his 65th Xmas was his last.

all of this has guided how I live my life. I don’t have much more than a bent up pot to piss in, but my family is healthy and happy and my kids are becoming productive citizens and realize what life is about.
I will always remember all the baseball games I coached, all the dumb ass cross country meets I went to, all the scout functions, etc…. I may not have cash, but I am rich with memories as are my family.

 

I also live in RI not much off roading here but we do get lots and lots of snow! There are very few runners if any on the lots here. Tarbox has got zero 4Runners and only 9 Tacomas.

 

I have thought about starting a snow storm recovery crew for the north when the weather gets bad. I enjoy helping other people get pulled out of bad situations so they can get where they need. When I was in northern Arizona during a bad snow storm this past winter I helped people and enjoyed it so much.

Figured a picture would be nice….
There was 36” of snowfall in a day or two. Needless to say I found people stuck in interesting places and would love to help pull them out again… My wife gets mad at me for watching YouTube but I learned something from Matt’s Off-road Recovery.

 

I have pulled a few people out of a ditch over the years. I carried a tow strap in my '03 at all times. I try to help people when I can. I haven't done a snow recovery with the winch yet. I'll bet it's nice!

 

I must have missed the snow the last few years, haha. Seems like every winter we're supposed to get it with one or two "big" storms, then it's much ado about nothing. I remember the 2015 winter was a heavy hitter though, that's the one where it snowed over a foot like once a week through feb and march. I think there was a good storm or two in 2018 the year before I got my 4Runner. I was driving my AWD Volvo wagon through bumper deep snow to get my GF to work, that car is a beast in the snow, haha.

I take Rt 4 past Tarbox at least once a week, I did notice their inventory looks mighty thin. I always think to myself "hmmmm, I wonder if they'd buy mine?" LOL. Langway in Newport is the same. Last time I drove by they had like 1 Taco and 4R.

I've been wanting to go on one of the Northeast Adventure Company runs to get in some offroading trips, but tickets sell out so fast to their events. Plus I've been slowly accumulating gear for a year now, and STILL don't have all the required stuff. I keep finding out new things they suggest/require to go out on runs with them. I have a hard time convincing myself to invest in all this gear that I'll only use once or twice a year.

 

I learned from M.O.R.R. that you can't beat an XJ! I've seen that XJ pull out many a Toyota on that channel, haha. I really love that channel, I've learned a lot from it too, and Matt seems like a genuinely nice guy. Casey too, on Casey's Recovery.

 

Yeah I concur. We can all find ourselves in situations. Matt built his rig up right and his new morvaire (probably spelt wrong) is really nice. I think he is on 40’s with that thing. But that beast has no problems with anything. I would be curious how much he has into that rig.

 

I wasn't even looking to trade in my '17 Limited, but the resale values are crazy right now, so I got into a new Venture trim with a 3" lift and cut my payments in half

 

Drove by my local dealership over the weekend. The lot was almost empty. Only 16 new vehicles. They had one taco, 2 highlanders and rest were cars.