Vehicle Data Transmission

Who has Turned their VDT off? Im really considering doing it. I dont like the idea of all my movements being tracked, they know how much gas i have and what my mileage is just to name a few.

Has anyone used their SOS button?

Makes me think of On Star. And they can unlock your vehicle or turn in off with a push of a button from some office in BFE

 

Whooooa hold up... What is this VDT you're talking about?? Is this just a feature on the 2020's or do the '19s have it as well?? If so I would definitely like to turn it off. I read through just about my entire owner manual (to catch sneaky stuff like this) when I got my runner and didn't see anything about that.

 

I feel much the same, for me everything that’s being added is for safety features at the cost of privacy. I’ve never been a fan.

I tried to follow the instruction about turning off the SOS feature. The first time I actually made and SOS call but your able to disconnect before connecting to and operator.

A lot of the features seem to help people that can’t help themselves. I’m not suggesting this is a fact, just what I tend to notice. The adaptive cruise control... absolute trash. Here in Texas people don’t seem to believe in CC and therefore, drive all different speeds. The constant stop and throttle of the acceleration had me so frustrated I wanted to crash the damn thing on purpose.

Again, most of these are features I find useless. I don’t like being tracked, I’m tired of sacrificing my privacy for market competition. Tirade over!

 

I believe these features to be form 2020 and newer. I remember such people having this discussion as a pro to buy a 19 over a 20. You should be A OK

 

Thanks for the info regarding the '19 vs '20.

I feel the same way! Everything else is tracking us, from our phones to our purchases ect. The last thing I want is for any data from my vehicle to be turned over to Toyota to analyze.

I, also, can't stand that adaptive CC!

 

Whether you keep it on or off, anytime you connect your vehicle to the internet via your phone, all that data is transmitted.

 

https://www.toyota.com/privacyvts/images/doc/privacy-portal.pdf

 

You do realize that if you just hold the CC button a few seconds, it becomes a traditional CC.

 

I actually just turned the whole thing off, appreciate it though.

 

Yes, it was an option in the '19, but it seems to be standard in the '20.

 

Is that fin only the GPS? Nothing else uses it? If you cut the cord, let is know!!!

 

One more reason to build not buy.

 

Everybody wants your data to monetize it against your best interests but that doesn't mean you have to let them have unfettered access to it.

One more reason I opted to buy a 2019 - I hate all those damn nannies and subscription services Toyota introduced.

I don't care for integrated GPS - a $99 (or less) stand alone GPS unit (Garmin device or tablet with free Gaia app) would be just fine with me.

You can always just turn your cell phone off and carry it with you in case you need it, and don't pair it with, or plug it into, your vehicle.

 

Agreed.

But again, just for clarity and to the best of anyone's knowledge, does pairing your phone via Bluetooth to a 2019 allow any vehicle data to be transferred or collected?? And by pairing I mean just for calls/music.

 

I bought my 4r in Jan. And went with the last 2019 on the lot just for these reasons (ORP but not loaded up with a bunch of the garbage). My last SUV had all the garbage and I did not like it. Every time it rained the cruse sensor got water on it and started beeping at me to take it in for service. Hated it. Love the 4r for this and many other reasons.

 

For those with the app. Look at your driving score. I drive very conservative and my insurance would have dinged me...why? I had many hard braking tags that is impossible to avoid in Chicago. Guessing insurance would rather you take out the jackass that slammed on his brakes in front of me.
I had mine shut off but was a pain in the ass. Toyota makes you jump through hoops to get out of something that I was never informed that we were automatically signed up for

 

Very glad to see this discussion. More people should be tuning into this issue. It's not just a question of privacy. There's significant potential for hackers or governments to manipulate your vehicle. Any computer connected to the Internet can be hacked remotely, and most vehicle computers are. This includes Limiteds from before 2020, as they had Connected Services. Certain Sirius features have also had their own connection and data transmission for many years.

It's not paranoid to assume that certain hostile nations have already compromised systems like this and OnStar as part of a larger cyber warfare strategy. We know that has already occurred with other systems used by many tens of millions of Americans. So there's already an ability of a country like China to send the lives of millions of people into turmoil in the context of a larger cyber or other kind of attack.

Law enforcement has already tapped into these systems to shut off the vehicles of suspects, and to record conversations within vehicles to support arrests and prosecutions. You may or may not trust law enforcement to use this power only within Constitutional bounds and only to "catch the bad guys." I know better. But you certainly can't trust China or Russia.

Do we really want someone to be able to turn our engines on or off, or in some vehicles to be able to steer or apply the brakes, from an Internet-connected computer anywhere in the world?

So this goes well beyond location tracking, which occurs constantly anyway both via your cell phone and from now-ubiquitous license plate readers.

As far as I know, the only reliable way to prevent the physical manipulation of your vehicle, the collection of personal data and the ability to record conversations is to disable any Internet connection. That means destroying or disconnecting the cellular transmitter.

 

In case it's not obvious, I should clarify that it's not enough to opt out from these services. It's a good step to take if you rather protect your privacy than have the convenience of these services. But any system that can be turned off can also be turned back on. Hackers could do it without Toyota's cooperation. Toyota could do it in response to a government request.

You can't trust Toyota's system to be invulnerable. And you sure as hell can't trust that they won't cooperate with government requests. They've already told you that in their Privacy Disclosure. Note that their cooperation is not limited to subpoenas or court orders or warrants. It just references government requests and investigations.

 

There doesn't appear to be any online method of opting out of all this crap. Do we really have to place a call to Toyota??

 

GPS isn't inherently a problem, since the satellites are only sending data to your GPS receiver, not receiving data back. The problem arises when your GPS receiver is connected to the Internet / cellular, or in your case when you upload that data.

BUT, preventing location tracking isn't realistic anyway. There are way too many sources of data on our locations. License plate readers are pretty much everywhere on public roads. Multiple private companies take photos of your license plates on a regular basis. Any company or government agency can buy those photos complete with time, date and GPS data. These photos often show things besides your license plate. They can capture other parts of the vehicle. There are no laws constraining it. That's just one example of location tracking.

That's bad enough. Then there's the ability of either hackers or governments to listen to your private conversations, and to take remote control of your vehicle.

 

A few other thoughts (and we should keep this thread going):

1. The manuals with my 2020 Limited say you can opt out of connected services by pressing the SOS button and talking to Toyota.

2. The Privacy Disclosure linked earlier in this thread contains a mailing address in addition to a phone number. I would recommend verbally opting out and requesting data deletion, then sending a letter to this address to memorialize that verbal request and to reiterate it. We should be able to trust Toyota to follow their own procedures and keep their promises. Just note the caution I made earlier: hackers could still turn these systems back on, and Toyota will do it themselves if asked by the government.

3. My infotainment system contains an option for asking Toyota to delete my personal information.

4. The most helpful things that could come from this thread are:
a) awareness, so people will know the risks
b) awareness, so people will support legislation to better protect our rights and property
c) a good solution for disabling the cellular connection in these vehicles. Yes, you can chop off the shark fin. But that's just the antenna and there must be a better way. Most people don't even know where exactly the cellular transmitter is located.

 

I don't know where the transmitter is but sure would like to. And agree that removing the antenna might not be enough.

 

When I paired my 2019 TRD ORP with my phone, the 4Runner asked for permission to access certain things on my phone - contacts, SMS, and I don't remember what else. It obviously needs your contact and SMS info for the hands-free features of calling and reading your texts to you.

If you set your GPS 'Go Home' option, it knows where you live also. I always set these options to a location far enough away but close enough so that if I get to that place, I inherently know how to go the rest of the way home.

What it does with this data is not clear to me. I hope it stays local to the vehicle and when I use the head unit menu option to delete my data that it does that also.

 

According to https://www.toyota.com/content/connectedservices/marketing/PDF/MY19_Connected_Services_Table.pdf the 2019 4Runner did not have any models with "Connected Services"

According to https://www.toyota.com/content/connectedservices/marketing/PDF/MY20_Connected_Services_Table.pdf different models of the 4Runner had different "Connected Services"

It sounds like a lot of the "extras" come with your installation of the Entune mobile app on your phone.

Have you registered your vehicle with Toyota and provided them even more information about you?

The fine print disclaimer on that 2020 Connected Services PDF is this:
1. Toyota Safety Connect depends on an operative telematics device, a cellular connection, navigation map data and GPS signal strength and other factors outside of Toyota’s control, all of which can limit system functionality or availability, including access to response center and emergency support. Stolen vehicle police report required to use Stolen Vehicle Locator. Registration required. Service subject to change at any time without notice. Terms of Use apply. Service may vary by vehicle and region. See usage precautions and service limitations in Owner’s Manual and Toyota.com/connected-services/ for additional details. To learn about Toyota’s data collection, use, sharing and retention practices, please visit https://www.toyota.com/privacyvts/. The Safety Connect trial period is at no extra cost and begins on the original date of purchase or lease of a new vehicle. After the trial period expires, enrollment in paid subscription is required to access the service. 2. Contact with the response center may not be available in all areas. Service Agreement required. A variety of subscription terms available; charges will vary. See Toyota.com for details. 3. Information provided is based on the last time data was collected from the vehicle and may not be up to date. Service Connect depends on an operative telematics device, a cellular connection, navigation map data, GPS signal strength and other factors outside of Toyota’s control, which can limit functionality or availability. Service may vary by vehicle and region. Registration required. Service subject to change at any time without notice. Terms of Use apply. See usage precautions and service limitations in Owner’s Manual and Toyota.com/connected-services for additional details. To learn about Toyota’s data collection, use, sharing and retention practices, please visit https://www.toyota.com/privacyvts/. The Service Connect trial period is at no extra cost and begins on the original date of purchase or lease of a new vehicle. After the trial period expires, enrollment in paid subscription is required to access the service. 4. Use only if aware of circumstances surrounding vehicle and it is legal and safe to do so (e.g., do not remotely start engine if vehicle is in an enclosed space or vehicle is occupied by a child). Remote Connect depends on an operative telematics device, a cellular connection, GPS signal strength and other factors outside of Toyota’s control, which can limit system functionality and availability. Service may vary by vehicle and region. Registration and app download required. Terms of Use apply. Data charges may apply. Remote start/stop not available on manual transmission-equipped vehicles. Services subject to change at any time without notice. See usage precautions and service limitations in Owner’s Manual and https://www.toyota.com/connected-services for additional details. To learn about Toyota’s data collection, use, sharing and retention practices, please visit https://www.toyota.com/privacyvts/. The Remote Connect trial period is at no extra cost and begins on the original date of purchase or lease of a new vehicle. After the trial period expires, enrollment in a paid subscription is required to access the service. Terms and conditions apply. 5. Wi-Fi Connect is available on select 2018 and newer Toyota vehicles. Visit Toyota.com for vehicle availability. Verizon Wireless is the network provider for Wi-Fi Connect, which uses Verizon’s 4G LTE network to transmit data. Data usage and charges apply. Coverage not available everywhere; see vzw.com. See verizonwireless.com/bestnetwork for details. LTE is a trademark of ETSI. Other terms apply. Up to 5 devices can be supported using in-vehicle connectivity. Verizon Wireless data subscription required upon end of 6-month trial period or use of 2-GB data (whichever comes first). Use of Wi-Fi Connect subject to Verizon Wireless’ Customer Agreement (verizonwireless.com/legal/notices/customer-agreement/), Privacy Policy (verizon.com/about/privacy/privacy-policy-summary), and data use policies (verizonwireless.com/support/vz-email-legal/). Apps and services subject to change at any time without notice. 6. Destination Assist depends on an operative telematics device, a cellular connection, navigation map data and GPS signal strength and other factors outside of Toyota’s control, which can limit system ability, functionality or availability. Use common sense when relying on this information. Service may vary by vehicle and region. Registration required. Services subject to change at any time without notice. Terms and conditions of subscription services agreement apply. See Owner’s Manual and Toyota.com/connected-services for additional limitations and details. To learn about Toyota’s data collection, use, sharing and retention practices, please visit https://www.toyota.com/privacyvts/. The Destination Assist trial period is at no extra cost and begins on the original date of purchase or lease of a new vehicle. After the trial period expires, enrollment in a paid subscription is required to access the service. 7. Renewal pricing and services are subject to change at any time without prior notification. All pricing excludes taxes and Dealer labor fee is required to perform Map data updates. Dealer labor charges may vary by location. Dynamic Navigation & Destination Assist renewals available on Multimedia Premium Audio only. Scout® GPS Link renewal available on Multimedia Audio and Multimedia Audio Plus only. Safety, Service, Remote, and Wi-Fi renewals available on Multimedia Audio Plus & Multimedia Premium Audio only. Contact with the response center for connected services may not always be available in some areas. 8. Eligible vehicle and wireless service required. Coverage and service not available everywhere. Valid in the contiguous U.S. and Alaska. Do not drive distracted. Go to att.com/toyota for terms and conditions. Wi-Fi Connect is available on select 2019 and newer Toyota vehicles. Visit Toyota.com for vehicle availability. Data usage and charges apply. Up to 5 devices can be supported using in-vehicle connectivity. Services subject to change at any time without notice. The Wi-Fi Connect trial period is at no extra cost and begins on the date of activation. After the trial period expires, enrollment in a paid subscription is required to access the service. Terms and conditions apply.

 

Good info. But Safety Connect has been a feature on the 4R Limited since 2015, as per https://www.toyota.com/content/entune/pdf/Safety_Connect_Legacy_Support.pdf

While this is a lot less by way of connected services than what’s on the 2020 models, it’s still an internet connection, via cellular, from your car. (Plus location tracking). There’s still a microphone to collect audio from inside the car. There’s still a question of how much a hacker, or Toyota at the behest of the government, could do with that connection to either manipulate the car or to collect your data.

 

Safety Connect, I was unaware that it pre-dated Connected Services. Good info, and according to this http://toyota.custhelp.com/app/answ...-vehicles-are-available-with-safety-connect®? Safety connect started with the 5th gen 4Runners in 2010, perhaps only the Limiteds?

 

New member here, two day owner of 2020 SR5. This thread is an eye opener. Thank you OP and everybody for the info!

 

I get emails from Toyota telling me my windshield fluid is getting low. What else do they know about me?

 

Where your truck is at any given time. Probably how fast you're driving, cornering and braking (you can opt out of sharing this information with insurers, but I'm not sure we know whether Toyota still collects it -- regardless, we know they can collect it anytime they want to). Plus of course all the personal info you've willingly provided to them as part of the purchase, any Toyota app use, etc.

But IMHO the bigger issue is the vulnerability of these connected services to abuse by entities other than Toyota. I don't really distrust Toyota per se. Well, other than they probably want to monetize your data. Like a lot of tech companies.

But we all know they will hand over the keys to the kingdom in response to a government request, whether that's to remotely immobilize your truck or eavesdrop on your conversations inside it. And we have like zero reason to trust that these systems are immune to hacking by lone cybercriminals, or ransomware gangs, or hostile nations.

 

As soon as the Russian hackers get tired of shutting down oil pipelines and extorting money from our industries they’re coming for your 4Runners.