Bilstein 8112/8100 - Cross Post

So even with the 8112 at the lowest setting of 1.5” of lift, I am losing down travel? Using your example, the best case scenario with an 8112 is 6” compression and 3” of droop? Or does the Dobinsons UCA return a small amount of droop? In the article I linked about racing suspension they mention shooting for 2/3 compression and 1/3 droop, but that was in a track racing scenario.

I just spoke to Bilstein, and I'm not sure if the tech is just reading from a script, or didn't understand the my question, but he said the ride height won’t impact down travel on the 8122. I have a hard time believing that, but that was Bilstein’s take.

 

This is why lifting an IFS falls into "want to look good rolling parking lots" and "if you need it, you need it". Otherwise, you want as little as possible for your needs and you can cover gaps with armor.

 

Always losing down travel. All a lift does is change your neutral ride height point. He might be interpreting it as droop in which case you will have the same droop, you'll just have less travel from neutral to full droop. I don't have experience with any 4Runner UCAs yet but any with heim designs should give an extra little bit.

The 1/3 down to 2/3 up is a good target... race is obviously going to be tailored to the course but for a daily that should be a good target and you can tweak from there.

 

I'm more a Timbren guy but Duros and Sumo are also solid picks. While you will hit them sooner, that's intentional to make the hit softer and they don't generally impact travel in practice.

It's about an hour or so work to adjust them so yeah just pick a setting and take it from there. A real world shakedown will tell you more than paper math every time.

 

I am returning the 4.25" DuroBumps in exchange for the standard DuroBump rated for zero lift to two inches. I also ordered the Billstein B12 Special 1.5" rear coils since the Bilstein tech guy told me today the rear shock is rated for up to two inches. The OME 2895 is a 2" - 2.5" coil, and it just feels like too much, especially if I run less lift in the front. At this point, I am considering setting the 8112 at 2", which should match the rake well with the 1.5" rear coil. I am considering having my installer remove the diff drop since it doesn't seem necessary if I only lift the front two inches. Shock Surplus recommended running the 8112 at a lower lift to stay in the sweet spot of the 8112 zone control and to get the most from the suspension. After learning how the JCO valve works in the 8112, less lift makes sense. The pan hard bar relocation bracket I have has two height adjustment locations, so that should still help to fine-tune, and I will go ahead with the Dobinsons rear adjustable sway bar links since they can be dialed in to get perpendicular no matter what height the rear is lifted. I will also proceed with the Icon front sway bar relocation bracket since it will create more room around the larger diameter coilover. I don't see any issues clearing the 285/70 tires at 2"/1.5", and those heights should be great for the 8112/8100 setup.

My installer thinks I am out of my mind, and he isn't entirely wrong. But even though I like the look of a 3/2 lift, having everything work well is more important.

 

You should only need "lift" bumps if you have a shock/strut that is significantly longer than stock when compressed or if larger tires will rub when stuffed. Otherwise the suspension arc remains unchanged and you can run standard bumps.

I think your plan is sound, and what I said above only applies to the front so you can use spacers in the rear if you feel you want a little more or if you get a lean. There the shock will be the limiting factor on downtravel (much like a Jeep) so as long as that's not so long you're bottoming it out before the bumpstop, you're good to go.

 

From what I have read and the pictures I've seen of 4Runners with the Bilstein 1.5" rear springs, I don't think I'll need spacers. But it is good to know I can do that if needed. The DuroBumps I ordered are the same size as stock, or maybe slightly taller but softer. My installer will probably give me shit about returning the OME rear spring, but it shouldn't be a big deal. They are primarily a Toyota shop and have done a ton of lifts since there is a lot of rugged terrain where I live. Still, I don't think they have gone as deep into the intricacies of Toyota IFS and kind of lean towards doing what the customer wants instead of optimizing for the best performance. They are in business to make money, so I don't fault them, but I am happy I took the time to wrap my head around this to make the best decision for me. I'm old, I just want this to work well and not cause problems in other parts of my rig.

 

Bilstein 8112 at 2” in from, 8100 with 1.5” B12 springs out back. Dobinsons UCAs, Bilstein front sway bar relocation bracket, DrKDSS pan hard bar correction bracket, DuroBump bump stops F/R,and Dobinsons adjustable rear sway bar links. I had my installer remove the diff drop. On my short drive to dinner everything feels awesome! Sunday I need to go explore a rough track out to an off-grid property and will have a better idea of how it all behaves then. I purchased an Icon front sway bar spacer, but the 8112’s come with a Bilstein sway bar spacer, which my installer ended up installing instead.

Interestingly, the rear height with a Bikstein B12 1.5” lift spring and the longer rear shock is exactly what it was before, 24” from hub center to the bottom of the fender flares. The front set to 2” of lift per Bilstein specs is at 22 3/4”, just a 1/4” lower than before.

On the road it steers straighter and doesn't feel as loose. The body roll and brake dive are gone, and the ride feels significantly improved. It feels like going from a Jeep CJ to a Porsche Cayenne. I can't wait to drive the beat up road out to nowhere on Sunday!

 

I received a reply from Bilstein from an inquiry a while back and wanted to share it here to add more information to the thread.

"Thank you for contacting Bilstein of America and your interest in our products. All of Bilstein’s lift struts are designed to be used as stand-alone kits. We do not recommend the use of spacers with our products. We find these products tend to overextend the vehicles suspension on down travel and limit the suspension on up travel. Using spacer kits does void the limited lifetime warranty on the product. With that being said I would also like to note I have included a link to our catalogue which displays all of the products that we offer for your vehicle. You will find that all of the products that we offer for the rear are designed to accommodate a 2” max lift in the rear. If your vehicle is going to have a 2.5” lift, we would recommend reaching out to distributors like Summit Racing or Off Road Warehouse. They are authorized distributors of our products but also of many other large shock absorber manufacturers.Hopefully, they can recommend a comparable product for your vehicle with its modifications. I will provide you with their contact information down below should you want to reach out. I hope you found this information helpful. If you have any other questions, please feel free to reach back out. Thank you."

 

Here are some pictures of the components from ground level.

 

Congrats!

I'm glad you decided against the spacers.

Hopefully you're happy with how it turned out.

 

I’m returning home from some Forest Service road exploration, and the suspension is incredible on washboard roads. I have never driven anything this nice, on rough roads. 50 MPH on washboard is incredibly smooth. I couldn't be happier with the setup.

 

Best bolt on suspension out there for the 5th gen 4Runner, IMO.

 

Those 8112s are height adjustable threaded shock bodies, why would you need spacers?

 

I was getting up to speed with the intricacies of Toyota IFS and was learning and asking questions. I started the thread because I wasn't finding answers that helped me understand the nuances of different setups. Hopefully this post will help others in the future.

 

Glad you posted your questions and process, and glad for the responses to them. I’ve watched Tinkerer’s vids more than a few times, which helped me understand a lot. But for the math and geometry challenged like me, I still have trouble with all the possible variations of setup decisions and their downstream impacts. Literally, there are a lot of moving parts to understand lol. Kai’s explanations and visual demonstrations are absolutely required though to get a foundational understanding of what’s going on with IFS.

 

Today, my suspension mechanic installed a 10 mm driver-side spacer on the rear coil and a Dobinsons adjustable pan hard bar. I went from nearly an inch off center with the rear axle to 3/16"s. Close enough for the girls I go out with! Although I could probably use a 20 mm spacer on the driver's side. Maybe someday.