Which ones have the front diff problem?

Hello all. I have read about this front diff needle bearing problem and can't tell if all 5th gen's have the potential for this problem or only certain years and/or trim levels (orp, TRD, etc.). I have a 2020 sr5, 6k miles, no mods. I have experienced no problems, just curious.
Thank you!

 

Your probably fine. I have a 18’ and haven’t experienced any issues with the drive train after 31k.

Most people have this issue, within the first year of ownership.

 

I’d say your chances are good that you wont get the noise now if you dont have it already. My 21 made the noise since new. Now that it has 40,000 miles, the noise pretty much has gone away.

But if you live in a warm climate and move to a cold climate, you might get it. Mine made the sound when temps were cold (usually below freezing).

 

I have a’22’ ORP I purchased in May. Almost 14k miles with several miles in 4WD…not a peep. Works as its supposed to.

 

I think all with the ADD front diff can have the issue or at least I haven’t seen any Limited owners specifically say they have issues.

 

Do Limited 4Rs have the same front differential with the infamous needle bearing?

 

It’s mostly the same but they are AWD so no ADD.

 

My 2010 developed it at around 90k, and my 2019 developed it at around 26k and was replaced under warranty. Seems to me that they all have the potential to be problematic. Having said that, I have never heard of the issue going beyond an NVH issue to an actual failure of the diff.

 

Not true. The 2wd ones don't.

 

So this happens early, no a lack of maintenence then
Just hearing of this

 

The 4WD Limiteds don’t use the needle bearing design either.

 

Mine was affected pretty much right away. I don't remember noticing it right when I got it, but it was within a week or two that I noticed the symptoms. This isn't always the case, though.

 

2016 Trail, started making noise around 55k miles. I noticed slop on the driver's side where the cv axle goes into the diff, the passenger side has zero play. I did the swap out with the bushing from East Coast Gear Supply but the noise did not go away. I suspect it is the carrier bearing in the diff. Drove it about another 5k miles and the noise is getting worse and now there is play in the bushing on the driver's side - zero play when first installed. Looks like a front diff replacement for me.

 

I had my front diff replaced somewhere between 6000-9000 miles for needle bearing noise. At 51,000 now with no issues.

 

What do they have? The Limited

 

I've heard of this issue several times and it is only the drivers side that is effected. As mentioned above, the limited does not have this needle bearing on the drivers side.

ECGS sells a bushing that corrects this problem: https://eastcoastgearsupply.com/i-8536125-toyota-8-clamshell-bushing-eliminates-needle-bearing.html

 

Thnx. Maybe someone will have a pic of the difference in what a Limited has. Havent found a part number yet.

 

I thought I was in the clear after not experiencing the symptoms the first 17k miles. Then the temperature started dropping and I noticed it. I installed the ecgs bushing a week ago and all is good again.

 

I'm not completely sure what the needle bearing does but since I read the needle bearing issue tends to show up in 2WD and lessen/go away in 4WD, the Limited's front axle - being engaged permanently - just won't have parts spinning quickly next to stuff that isn't like a part-time 4WD model in 2WD.

 

Okay that makes sense. If the part is engaged all the time, it's not spinning freely and then having to engage periodically

 

None. The CV inner shaft is supported by the diff carrier. In a full-time 4WD arrangement, there's no relative rotation between the CV shaft and the diff carrier in straight line driving. When cornering, the CV shaft rotates on the journal surface of the diff carrier. With part-time 4WD and ADD, the front diff is effectively differentiating 100% of the time in 2WD, so in Toyota's opinion the CV shaft needs to rotate on a rolling-element bearing.

 

I am pretty sure the actual number of reported problems is less than actual number of units having this issue.

Many people are simply numb to the symptom of this needle bearing issue. Especially with a spectrum of symptom severity

 

Have you noticed any MPG drop with the bushing ?

 

is the amount of play( CV into the diff), greatly reduced with the new diff?

also, how severe was the symptom, for dealer to properly diagnose it? My 4R at 500miles is demonstrating this periodically. If I turn the radio volume up to normal listening level, the music will consistently mask the noise. Vibration is still there, but no longer magnified by the complimentary rumble sound

 

Too early to tell, I’ve maybe driven 50 miles since without any attention to mpg shown on the dash.

 

Yeah the problem is infrequent enough for Toyota not to do any significant design changes to the front diff in 21 years. My 2010 SR5 at stock height doesn't have this problem at 148k. My 2018 Tacoma lifted 2.7" didn't have this problem. Buddy with 3" lifted 2019 Tacoma had no issues for 63k.

 

2022 ORP with 2.75" lift in the front. Developed the needle bearing sound around 12k miles. Changed for the ECGS bushing around 16k miles. Haven't heard it since, play in CV is greatly reduced.

 

Any mpg drop after the bushing ?

 

maybe 0.5 mpg? Since I already had lift and 285s, didn't really care. Just wanted the noise gone LOL. Since then, I have also gotten OTT tune so whatever MPG I lost I got back and some.

 

Now that I’ve put around 1,000 miles on since replacing the needle bearing, I can say my 80 hour average on my display didn’t change from the 17.4 mpg it was showing before the swap. I’ve also monitored both city and highway driving, and m still getting around 16 mpg city and around 21 mpg highway. This is with a 2” lift, Sherpa roof rack, sliders, and stock sized Wildpeak tires.