My DCM disconnection odyssey.

Or you could do it this way.......................post 160 and 161

https://www.4runners.com/threads/ho...telemetry-on-the-5th-gen-4runner.20628/page-6

 

That's definitely an easier way to do it....the glove box is a PITA to remove.

I'm not clear on the connectors....there's a total of three coaxial connectors going to the DCM: White, Grey and Blue. I pulled the white & grey and left the blue. Can't verify cellular since I'd already killed my DCM via Toyota. I'd assumed that one of them is GPS....not sure if the DCM has a role in the factory navigation option, or if it's just GPS for telematics.

However, the NAV on my SR5 Premium still works fine with white & grey disconnected.

 

Best you read through the other thread on this subject in particular #119 and #196. I have opted out of safety connected or whatever it's called and pulled antennas wires, but still transmitting near cell towers so I pulled the DCM fuse about 9 months ago as I remember. This is the only way I do not see bars on my DCM, so I not transmitting anymore. I have no lights or warnings or codes from DCM fuse being pulled. I did put it back in for one day about two months ago when I had my Toyota dealer install new Michelins.

 

I didn't have a signal on my DCM, even with the antennas connected. I disconnected the antennas because I'm taking the suspenders-and-belt approach with this.

I have read the other thread, which is why I was looking for compatible connectors that I could use to install terminators....no luck on that yet. I haven't gotten a definite ident on the connectors Toyota is using.

There's two levels to keep in mind. There's the safety connect subscription that you have to pay for. Even if you cancel/opt out of Safety Connect, the vehicle telematics are still active and sending data to Toyota. If you want to go completely offline, you have to call Toyota (using the SoS button) and ask them to "Disable Data Transmission". When you do that, Toyota will send a command to the DCM that knocks it completely offline without needing to unplug the antennas. You'll need to visit a dealer and get the DCM reprogrammed in order to turn it on again in the future.

If your SoS button is green, you still have an active DCM/telematics.

 

… or so the story goes.

I’ll be interested in seeing the results when someone puts some terminators together.

 

I don't think Toyota is operating maliciously....I don't think they're knowingly claiming to disable data transmission and then not doing so. If it doesn't get completely disabled, it'll likely be because of incompetence: They intended to disable it but didn't quite pull it off.

In this case, I think Toyota is trying very hard to get it right. Can you imagine the size of the lawsuit if they screwed it up? There are plenty of lawyers in the class-action business who would love to take Toyota to the cleaners if they left data collection on while telling their customers otherwise.

The most likely path for the DCM to come back to life is if the dealer gets a firmware update from Toyota for the DCM, and in the process of flashing that to the DCM it gets reactivated. If Toyota did this right, the first time after that the DCM tries to check in, it'll get told to go back offline again. If I can put terminators in, it won't even get that chance.

The challenge is the connector...when you're Toyota Motor Company, and you're buying parts to build millions of cars, you can call up a connector company and ask for a completely custom connector and they will be delighted to supply. Usually, manufacturers will use an off-the-shelf connector because that's cheaper and easier.

Since I don't have a copy of Toyota's BoM, I have to look at pictures of connectors and connector dimensions and hopefully find a match. I know it's an RF coaxial connector, and it's automotive rated. That narrows it down a lot. Once I know the connector, I'm hoping that I can find someone making a ?connector? to SMA adapter cable. Most of the coaxial connectors need $expensive crimping tools to install them onto cables.

 

I think the word here is...."Oops"

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/ne...data-leak-after-access-key-exposed-on-github/

 

Thanks for posting that.

 

I did all the app/calling/letter disconnecting options back in 2020. My DCM signal meter is grayed out but the "DCM" is lit up. I have not been checking but will monitor it and report back if I see it showing the arrows that it is transmitting. After this thread I just called into 800-331-4331 and requested 'my dcm to be disconnected'. She stated I had to go to the dealer for that but that my services were already all disconnected in 2020. I asked if I wanted them back could I just do it now over the phone, to which she said I could. So that is a bit different from what others have been told. When I hit the SOS button up top I get the same message about it not being connected. Infotainment option for “Check for Software Update” can be toggled from ON or OFF. It is not grayed out.

I will call the 1749 number tomorrow and make the same request. Does this seem like I am on the same page with all of you? Good to go? Will report back if I find anything new.

 

I think you are not totally good to go. The DCM bars should be grayed and crossed out, and as you know the “Check for Software “ toggle should be disabled. You can try the 1749 number, but if you are not successful you should try the 4331 number again and try to get a different person. In either case be sure to make it clear that you want your DCM disabled (not just disconnected).

 

Thanks for the reply. The DCM bars are grayed out "DCM" light is on though, the signal meter is gray. I actually called both today and was told by a supervisor that once you waive the options that the DCM is disabled. If you merely cancel connected services the DCM is still active. And those two numbers, all route to the same place and the rep isn't aware of which number you even called. They said they have a high call volume so both sides are answering all incoming calls. I was abundantly clear that I know I already have connected services all off but wanted the DCM disabled. 3 reps today all said it was off, including one supervisor. Argh

 

Notice in this photo of my infotainment screen that the DCM bars aren’t just grayed, but also crossed out. Are yours crossed out. I don’t think that the DCM letters being lit is an indication either way. It’s worth noting that when I first called in the bars went gray the next day, but it was some time before they were crossed out.

You mentioned that on your truck the “Auto Update Check” toggle is not disabled. Why not go to Menu —>Setup—> General—>Software Update and press the “Check for Software Update” button.” See if the arrows blink.

Edited to add: I don’t think that a red light on the SOS button means that the DCM is deactivated. Only that Connected Sevices have been unsubscribed.

 

Great articles. Thanks for those links.

I’m very interested in the details of your interaction with AT&T. Whom did you call? Did you have to provide an account number? If so, how did you get it? If not, how did you identify your car to AT&T? You mentioned a SIM card. My understanding is that there is no SIM card in the conventional sense, but that the SIM circuitry is soldered onto a board in the DCM. (I think I may have gotten that idea from another post in this thread.)

Regarding the event data recorder: I don’t know where it is in the vehicle or whether it is part of the DCM. I suspect it is a separate component (or components) as all Toyotas must have an EDR, but not all must have a DCM. (I read that EDRs have been compulsory in vehicles sold in the US since 2014, and that all Toyotas have had some version of an EDR since 2007.) I can imagine circumstances where, for purposes of establishing legal liability, I might be glad that certain information was recorded and accessible. I don’t know what information is gathered, or if there is overlap with the information collected by the DCM.

So, treating these as separate issues:
I believe with some confidence, that my car is no longer transmitting data. I do not know if the DCM is still collecting data, or whether Toyota can access it via the OBDii port. My guess is probably both.

I assume that the EDR is collecting data, and I’m positive that the dealer can retrieve it. I don’t know if that data can be retrieved through the OBDii port, or if there must be a more direct connection to the EDR. It would be interesting to know what data is collected, and if the EDR is the same for all Gen 5 4Runners.

Yes! There are ways to lock the OBDii port.

 

A vote for photon torpedos

 

Wow thanks for all that. I wonder if it’s a new policy that the vehicle owner must close the cellular account, or if my cellular account is still active. In my case the shutdown seemed to take place in two stages. Soon after my final phone call to Toyota Safety Connect the DCM bars went gray. A few weeks later the bars became gray and crossed out. I would guess that it was the closing of the cellular account that led to the crossing out of the bars.

It’s going to take me a while to work through all the links you provided. I’ll enjoy it.

 

Another security item. This mostly focuses on flaws found on the Hyundai's, but mentions in passing that Toyota also uses the SiriusXM system. Unclear if the security flaws are also present in the Toyota implementation:

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/ne...llowed-hackers-to-remotely-unlock-start-cars/

 

Interesting.

 

Wow.Interesting!

 

When I used the SoS button to request "deactivation of data transmission" in September, nothing was said about an AT&T account. I did this minutes after taking delivery of the truck, and definitely prior to setting up any services. What they did demand was that I have to give them my email address before they would deactivate the DCM because they wanted to send me an email confirming that I had requested deactivation.

I suspect the AT&T account is created when you sign up for Connected Services...probably to provide the internet connection to the onboard WiFi hotspot. If you never signed up (even for the free trial), no AT&T account.

 

Makes sense.

 

There's two different classes of data here: There's the onboard telematics that goes to Toyota, and there's the "Connected Services" that you can subscribe to, which provides the WiFi hotspot and some remote-control features through the Toyota phone app.

The WiFi hotspot isn't active until you set up some kind of subscription...can be the free 3-month subscription after vehicle purchase, or the paid subscription thereafter. I'm assuming that the separate AT&T account isn't created until you subscribe. Many of the dealers will very helpfully setup your trial subscription as part of the vehicle delivery process. I declined this because I already knew I was going to disable my DCM.

The telematics remain active, even if you don't have a Connected Services subscription. To get rid of those, you have to call up Toyota and request that they "disable data transmission." Only then will your DCM go completely offline.

Since I've already asked Toyota to disable my DCM, I don't have a simple way to find out which carrier it was originally using. With a physical SIM, I could pull the card out and read it. eSIM makes it a little more complicated. Unless somebody knows of a diagnostics screen in the Infotainment screen that will dump out the eSIM data, it'll likely remain a mystery. I'm not curious enough to jump through all the hoops to reactivate my DCM.

From my work with cellular data, the carriers used to assign a phone number to data-only devices, but have stopped doing that. Mostly because even with the additional area codes, the North American Numbering Plan doesn't have nearly enough phone numbers available to give every data-only cellular device a phone number that it will never use. These days, the carriers reference my data-only devices by IMEI.

That being said, I don't know how Toyota implemented the SoS feature....does it make a voice call over cellular, or VoIP using data? The former approach will have a phone number. The latter only requires some kind of URI that would be used to initiate a SIP call. If I was designing this, I wouldn't use a phone number....last thing I'd want is my vehicles getting mass-dialed robocalls!

 

Great write up
I was wondering if though you ever had the message come over the speaker (pass door) announce “Voice command module failure detected. Please contact your dealer” when you start the truck? I unhooked the overhead controls (map light, traction ect) molex for a mollie panel install and once reconnected it has been giving the announcement on every start.
Tried unhooking the batterie over night and to no avail.

 

Hmm. That’s a new one. I would re-check everything you unplugged and try re-plugging.

 

I'm revisiting this out of concern that telematics are still transmitted even with connected services disabled on my 2022. Based on some notifications I'm getting, I suspect that they are.

With the DCM still getting a signal near towers, I expect that telematics will still upload, just not continuously, so pulling the antennas isn't perfect. I know we can't pull the actual DCM unit without losing the microphone too (doing that is really petty btw - that has to be a deliberate engineering decision) because we lose it with the fuse.

I detest entune and the screen in the stock unit sucks, so now that idatalink has maestro I may just pull the fuse and have them install a separate microphone. Are we sure that the mic is the only other function that they routed though the thing? Anyone run for a while (months) with the fuse pulled without issue?

 

It's greyed out with the line, but I have suspicions that it's still connected in the background because of the dealer all-to-conveniently reminding me that I need service.

Good point on the GPS connection to the head unit. I may pull the fuse and remove the unit both to be sure.

Of course, other folks in the family have Tesla's which are the anti-privacy vehicle. Turn off connectivity and they stop working, so this is a bit like closing the portholes on the titanic.

FWIW, I never went through the carrier either - so maybe they only disconnected the services and not the whole line.

 

I don’t know about pulling the fuse and it’s long term effects.

If you are only getting DCM bars near cell towers, based on the experience of those who have posted here that would suggest that you opened up the dash and unplugged the cables from the DCM, but that Toyota has not disabled your DCM.

Did you call the number and ask to have the DCM disconnected?
Did you push the SOS button to see what would happen?
Does the light on the SOS button go out after you start the car?
Did you go into the menus and check to see if the “Auto Update Check” button is grayed out?

These things will tell you if your 4Runner is disconnected from the mother ship.

Notice in this photo of my infotainment screen that the DCM bars aren’t just grayed, but also crossed out. This is how they look all the time.


Cheers!

 

My fuse has been out for over 6 months and no issues. I do not need the microphone.

 

I haven't pulled the antenna's yet, but did disconnect via the button, and it no longer works and the light goes out. However, I'm not convinced that didn't just disconnect the 'connected services' and that it's still not transmitting telematics.

Great thanks. I think that'll be my plan - replace the head unit with one with a UI from this century, use an external microphone for calls with it, and then pull the fuse.

 

If you do end up replacing the head unit, could you post how that process goes? I’m curious how much these new vehicles tie into the HU. Does anybody know if this process is straightforward?

 

When this issue first came up I disconnected services through the Toyota app. Every time I start the truck the lights in the overhead console would alternate between green and red for a while (while searching for a signal I suppose) and then settle on red. In an attempt to stop that annoyance I removed the overhead console and broke it down so I could remove power going to the LED lights, which I did. After reinstalling it, the first time I started the truck that announcement came on through the stereo's speakers - something I posted on here at the time. After reconnecting the power plug in the overhead console, the message never came back. I suspect the power connector was for more than just the LED lights. Hope this helps.