4x4 SUV powertrains have become complex in a hurry

Thats right, I’d forgotten about the tire speed ratings.
Good thing there’s no speed governor, that would give this crowd one more nanny feature to gripe about.

 

Yes, my current tires are rated to 99 or 100 MPH. I don't really go over 90 with them for more than a few seconds at a time. I usually cruise at or below 85, and that's when I'm in a hurry.

Haha!

 

How many tires do you think have disintegrated from hitting their 100mph speed rating?

I'll answer my own question.......

None.

They overbuild them to handle more.

 

I would bet that it would need to be significantly higher, or sustained for a period of time. And, there must be a buffer. Still, 100 is fast enough for me in this boat!

 

I mean they did all the time on TV back when they used to have car chases in LA.

 

I've gone 90 mph for extended periods of time on straight highways in my 3rz (obviously I have someone going quicker in front of me to get the ticket ), no issues over heating whatsoever. A 4 cylinder is more than enough to get you to a disconcertingly fast speed for a 4runner.

 

Yes, turbo charged gasoline engines ARE inherently less reliable. Anytime you introduce additional complexity and heat into a mechanical system you increase the number of states that system can be in and thereby you increase entropy or the opportunities for a break down.

That's why the simplest properly engineered system will always be the most reliable.

You also have the double whammy of trying to make more HP with less emissions.


I'm sorry my numbers were wrong, its not 3 in seven that say they won't own another electric car, no, it's 4 in seven. The problem with electric vehicles, from a common sense point of view, are numerous. Especially, if you eliminate the ignorant notions of people on the left, and the political class in general. For them its rainbows and unicorns powering vehicles.

 

So, 4 in 7 are wrong. They will own another electric car eventually, or they will be walking. Don't get me wrong here, I am not ready for electric myself. They're nowhere near capable of how I use my vehicle.

As far as reliability, of course complexity adds potential points of failure. But, my Mom's boyfriend has a DODGE with more miles than most Toyotas will ever even see. And another at 400K. They're both turbocharged. So, while turbo vehicles are more complex, they're not unreliable.

 

I used to disparage hybrids until I owned one. Bought a Prius on impulse, really impressed by the little car. Put gas in it once a month, maybe. But it was little so I quickly moved up to a RAV4 hybrid and again super impressed with it. Around town I frequently got 50mpg.

Now that I work at home full time I wondered why I need gas sipping vehicle and decided it was time to get a 4Runner

Based on my experience, I believe plug in hybrids are the way the country should go. People that live/work in or near the city will have enough battery range and still have the gas engine-hybrid system for longer trips.

You may not need anything more than the 120 volt plug that you already have and save hundreds to thousands on having a charging station installed at your house.

More vehicles could have battery power by not needing as many per vehicle.

Think about what would happen when a storm causes major power outages for days and weeks and everybody has pure electric cars. Or when there is a mandatory evacuation ahead of a hurricane.

Back on topic, what the PowerBoost F150 has going would be awesome in a 4Runner. Good mpg, huge torque and onboard power for days. If Toyota can do that and keep the legendary 4Runner reliability, that would be on my Xmas list for sure.

 

I just returned from a 2,000 mile road trip to kentucky and back to Massachusetts and I can tell you that after driving 12 hours a day and filling the tank every 400 miles, I could NEVER do that in an electric vehicle. I would drive 300 miles, stop, charge , then drive another 300 and repeat..........no way!

 

I would be all for a hybrid 4Runner.

 

I’d take an electric over one that shuts itself off every time I stop at a stop sign.

 

Howdy, atmospheric scientist here. Electric cars need to stop! They are way worse for the environment than normal cars. A normal car can be on the road for 10 years and be cleaner than a brand new electric car. Toyota actually has a good solution with the Mirai. Hydrogen has the range of gas vehicles, does not require as big of an infrastructure change. Lastly, no lithium battery, that is already contaminating ground water. Releases water vapor in the atmo.

 

My thoughts are anything properly maintained is going to last a long time regardless of manufacturer. My wife and I are considering the 4Runner, Jeep Wrangler, and Bronco. All three are great choices and have advantages and disadvantages.

In the current lineup a 4Runner is going to have the reliability/comfort and lower maintenance costs. The Wrangler is going to blow the 4Runner away with capability in serious terrain that most of us are just not willing to risk our 50K vehicle in. The new Bronco is kind of in between the two.

I am not afraid one bit of a small turbo engine that is lighter and more efficient than a natural aspirated one. And when you go up in elevation the power drop is almost non existent on a turbo motor.

Times change and so does technology. I have learned to embrace it and move forward. In the end it will all be dependent on what sacrifices we are willing to make for our choice of vehicles.

For my wife, she wants compact and small. I want comfort, reliability, and the ability to upgrade suspension to my liking. I would be all over a RAV4 if it was a capable off highway and snow vehicle with aftermarket suspension choices.

 

Just my two cents and experiences here. I dont mind turbos in cars and suvs when done properly. However, they are not. Ford is the biggest guilty party of putting in small tiny engines and stuffing it with turbos and saying it can do more than a NA engine. Now I know guys who actually use their trucks, all of them have replaced their failed aluminum and blown turbo trucks to Ram. When you put two turbos in a v6 and say it can tow 12k, you set your self up for issues. The motor runs harder and hotter because it is two small for the truck itself and the turbos do all the work. The bronco is no different. If you put a 4cyl in a 4Runner which is already power deprived in a 6cyl. That 4cyl is going to be so overworked and run way hotter relying on the turbos. You can look up videos of people asking ford mechanics which engine they prefer, they all say the v8, less moving parts and less problems.

 

Maybe it's a Ford problem, and not necessarily an issue with turbo motors.

As long as the internal engine parts are build for the extra stress, there's no reason they can't be reliable. Look at diesels. And, look at how much power people have made with the 1JZ and 2JZ engines without issues. They can handle the extra strain because they're built for it.

 

I hear you Jeremy. The biggest issue, IMHO, is the drivers and owners themselves. Turbo engines require special care for longevity. Even if it's not in the manual, warm up and cool down are very important to get the most out of the turbos.

The last company I worked for had a few idiot drivers that had idle times that were over the top. One driver had over 8 hours idle time in a 60-70 hour work week. So they made a blanket statement to all the drivers to shut down immediately whenever making deliveries or stopping to park. My terminal manager and I both argued that it was setting up the trucks for turbo failure. Well the "efficiency expert" in charge found out very quickly turbo replacement cost was more than the fuel cost by idling a minute or two to allow turbo to cool down.

FWIW, the drivers of that company are still shutting engines down immediately after the truck stops and air brakes are engaged. They have made the offload times 30 minutes or less. Go figure.....

 

Thats true on diesels. Sadly, I dont think there is a gas turbo engine engineered that way yet. We will see what Toyota does on the new tundra, but my hopes are not that high

 

Have you ever heard of the Toyota 1JZ or 2JZ?

 

Yea, but they are no longer in production, and with all the stupid government mandates I don't think we will ever see a turbo gas engine like that again. Also they were inline 6 motors in a car that could have had a 4. So more than enough engine to handle the car the turbo was there for extra, but the base engine could handle the car. Unlike today we see cars with 4cyl that really need 6cyl in them.

 

I agree that most people dont take the extra measure to care for an engine with a turbo, but IMO the nice the nice thing about NA engines is, they did not require the extra care needed.

 

You would put a 4 cylinder in a 3500# car? At that time, most 4 cylinders were making around 100 hp at best.

Power to weight ratio doesn't change the fact that these motors were able to make ridiculous amount of power.

Unfortunately the times of big displacement motors are over. Turbos, hybrid and electric are where it's going.

I still believe that a well engineered turbo motor can be reliable. I think Toyota will prove me right.

 

Hopefully Toyota can do it right, but IMO large displacement motors are going to be missed. Just ask what sounds better a Ford Raptor or Ram TRX

 

Oh, yeah! Nothing sounds like a V8! Agreed there.

I've heard some good sounding 6's as well. But, the v6 Raptor does sound like shit.

 

I don't buy the argument that all turbo engines are less reliable than all naturally aspirated engines. Execution details matter.

https://www.startmycar.co.za/blogs/technical-articles/should-i-buy-a-turbo-will-it-last-as-long

 

Well there is always the 392 Hemi Wrangler!! LOL