Tires.....it's enough to make your head spin.

I'm educating myself.........I think? The more I read the dizzier I get.

Some of us remember when(bias) ply ratings referenced the actual number of plies in a tire.
Then, in 1965, radial tires became the standard tire design. By 1973, all U.S. automobile manufacturers had standardized with the radial tire, mostly due to its fuel-economy benefits.


"Today's load range/ply ratings do not count the actual number of body ply layers used to make up the tire's internal structure, but indicate an equivalent strength compared to early bias ply tires. Most radial passenger tires have one or two body plies, and light truck tires, even those with heavy-duty ratings (10-, 12- or 14-ply rated), actually have only two or three fabric plies, or one steel body ply."

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=55

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"Load range is based on an older measurement called ply rating. All tires are constructed of rubber and cord layers referred to as “plies”. Historically, more plies gave a tire a larger load carrying capacity, so manufacturers would count the plies and use this number to denote carrying capacity.

However, modern tire construction uses fewer, stronger plies. Therefore, load range simply defines the tire’s toughness and maximum allowable air pressure, as opposed to specific information about the actual plies being used. For example, a “C” load range indicates that a tire is equivalent to a 6-ply construction tire. This tire isn’t actually built with 6 plies, but rather one or two plies of equivalent strength."

https://www.americastire.com/learn/load-range-load-index

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Where am I going with this and why the post? I'm not sure other than,

I thought oil threads were crazy

 

Intermediate vehicles like the 4Runner can use many different types of tires.

Load rating isn’t an issue until you’re dealing with 3500 trucks. Then it suddenly becomes important.

 

True, but sidewall strength and an off roaders tire choice seem to go hand in hand. I'm not sure if there's a standard to be met before a manufacturer declares their tire's ply rating, or if it's arbitrary? It appears to be arbitrary

 

I have seen Kevlar off-road “performance” tires filleted open on rocks as well.

I don’t know what to believe.

 

None of them are bulletproof, but some stand up to the torture a little better than others.

 

Almost six days of reading and researching tire information on - tire sizes - load ratings - proper inflation/on and off road - etc, etc - and I'm whooped. That said, this AM I took a trip to my go to tire guy for the past 18 years - who happens to be the store manager and an off roader himself.

I had one simple question for him. Am I making a mistake sticking with the OEM P265/70/17 113S Terra Grapplers? His words....."had I thought you were, I'd have convinced you to change when we replaced your spare." Per him, while the chance of having a sidewall failure 'is a bit greater' with a P rated tire - it's not as great as some make it out to be. What is important, is airing down properly for the tire you're running, the load it's carrying, and the terrain it's being used on. In fact, he prefers the sidewall compounds used in the original Terra Grappler to those used in the Terra Grappler G2.

This post is for information purposes only. I have no intention of debating it. We all have an opinion and I consulted the person I most trust on the subject. No offense intended.

Tire............d

EDIT: worth the read.

https://www.outsideonline.com/outdo...ything-you-need-know-about-all-terrain-tires/
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Thanks for this info mate... You are right, it is enough to make your head spin!

Cheers,

Sean

 

A couple links saved that may be of interest?

https://tirepressure.com/p265-70r17-tire-pressure

https://tirepressure.com/toyota-4runner-tire-pressure

https://www.tiresplus.com/tires/tire-buying-guide/tire-load-index-chart/

https://www.4wheelparts.com/a/tire-wheel-package-guide-tire-pressure-checker

https://www.americastire.com/blog/airing-tires-down?storeCode=1085

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=195

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=196

https://www.4wheelparts.com/the-dirt/how-to-choose-the-right-air-pressure-for-your-tires/

https://www.4wheelparts.com/the-dirt/airing-down-the-best-free-mod-ever/

Enjoy

EDIT: 7/13/21 Time saving comparison tool with some cool features.

 

A lot of people talk shit on P-rated tires. They definitely get a bad rep simply because of the name. Of course some P-rated tires are complete garbage, but others are tough as nails. I've never had an issue with the ones I've had, but I completely acknowledge that the rocky terrain I encounter can be very different than someone in a different region (lava rock in Hawaii if fucking sharp!!).

Bottom line, buy what makes the most sense for your driving habits and terrain. For me, P and C-rated will do fine. For others, D and E-rated are a better fit.

 

I've run P, C, D, and E rated tires from a myriad of manufacturers. All of them will split, puncture, ect. Your best bet is to look at reviews and see what the guys doing what you enjoy doing are running. Load ranges and plys really don't apply to vehicles in our weight class.

 

My P265/70/17 113S Terra Grapplers met mud for the first time this long weekend.


But I'm very disappointed with them. BFG KO2s were my best choice and Wildpeaks were almost good as KO2s on mud I see here. I want to switch to a different tire in size 275/70R17 much sooner now. But my fav KO2 is only available in Load E and I don't like the hash on road comfort. The only Load C in a good brand I see is Wildpeaks which seem to be very heavy ( 58lbs vs stock Nittos are 41lbs), even more than Load Es. Def not going to add extra 85lbs just for tires.

Wildpeaks skinny tall tires 255/80r17 are 53lbs but only Load E is available, so no comfort on road.

With winter conditions here, tires with 3PMSF is my only choice. Right now I'm out of my choices on 275s or even ugly 255s.

With TSS-P on my 2021 I'm not comfortable lifting yet. If I lift it I would def get BFG KO2 Load C or try something new to me Goodyear Wrangler Duratrac if they have Load C or something soft on road.

I'm no kidding I even contacted Les Schwab on their 275/70R17 "Back country All Terrain". Waiting for their response on the specs. Not only 3PMSF rated LT275/70R17 Load C, I might be even open to P275/70R17 SL or XL to start with before I get lift and get proper tires.

 

@Moon Landing here's the details I got from Les Schwab for "Back Country All Terrain" LT275/70R17 Load C (They only have Load C & E in this size). I like the weight of this tire but sadly they do not have 3 peak mountain snowflake rating. So its a no from me.

Tire weighs - 46.9 lbs
Speed rating - R (106mph)
Overall Diameter - 32.2"
Section Width - 11.1
Tread depth - 17/32"
Load index - 114 - 2,600lbs per tire at 50 psi
Load Range - C
3PMSF Rating - No

 

Tires are good to have. I highly recommend them.

 

I went from a P rated tire to a C rated tire (KO2's) and the lack of "float" at all speeds is noticeable. They were 5 pounds more per tire, but the trade-off is worth it.

 

Personally speaking, C rated seem to be a good choice if they're available in the size, type and brand one desires.

 

Just for more perspective I have the Wildpeaks in 255/80R17 Load E and must say I enjoy the ride more than my former 265/70R17 Duratracs Load C. They're night and day better. However nothing has lived up to Cooper ST MAXX in 255/85R16 Load E I had on my last 4RNR for comfort + capability + longevity. Just saying I've never had a Load C tire I preferred over Load E but different strokes fer different folks

 

That says it all

 

Are you saying 255/80R17 Load E gave much comfortable soft ride than 265/70R17 Duratracs Load C? That is very hard to believe from the experience I had with 275/70R17 Load E vs 265 & 285 Load C.

 

I suppose I'll slightly revise my statement with me saying it felt more controlled and 'smoother' or 'planted', if that makes sense. Which I found I significantly preferred. Personally, softness according to my rear was the same. I will also say I have never had a 275 tire, not sure what others might be able to chime in with if that makes any difference. But I have only ever had stock or tall skinnies. Like the look and love the ride.

 

There are different advantages to "Skinnys" ( slicers ), and I'll call them "Fat Boys" ( floaters), depending on the terrain.

 

I like tires too!

 

I consider 285/70/17 skinny's........at least in my book.

Traditionally, a 33" tire used to be 12.5" wide, while 285's are roughly 11.5" wide.

I think they're a good fit on the 5th gen.

But that's just like my opinion, man.

 

I'm learning alot here and on this website since joining. I have not replaced my factory tires yet. Bridgestone Dueler HT 684II.
I agree that they are HORRIBLE in wet/snow/mud conditions. Toyota is doing a disservice to it's 4 runner customers by installing these AWFUL tires at the factory

 

Had to look at others reviews. They go from one extreme to the other. Crazy

https://www.bridgestonetire.com/tire/dueler-ht-684ii

 

'D' rated 8 ply 3 Peak covers a lot of bases.

 

Me personally would try to stay not more than Load C (Since we use our for road trips)..

 

One, if not the best, and most complete tire inflation guide I came across in my days of research. Many may already know this - others may not. This is for the 'may nots' that like to get in the *weeds. I find it a great tool to establish a baseline that can be tweaked to your personal liking.

*Method 2(in the weeds) is geekier and more technically correct, but requires some math

Proper implementation requires scaling your truck.(unless it's bone stock or very near stock weight).

https://www.motortrend.com/how-to/1801-the-pressure-where-should-you-run-your-tires/
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I'm thinking of these. Seems to fit my check boxes. Thought? (Feel free to give any bad comments.)

Nokian Rotiiva AT Plus LT 275/70R17 Load C (275mm is the max width my TRD Pro wheels approve)

• Weight - 44Lbs
• 3PMSF Rated - Yes
• Load Range - C
• Tread depth - 17
• Diameter - 32.1 (not a big deal, fraction taller than stock)
  
• Speed - 112mph (don't really care)

 

I hoping someone here can guide me. I have KO2s in LT265/70/17 C load. What is the correct tire pressure? 32psi or 44psi. I am absolutely confused.