Winter Driving Observations from a new T4R owner

You must have some excellent winter driving skills.

Here's the user rating on Tirerack.com

My 4runner went sideways on them at about 45 MPH. I was going straight, on a slight incline. I didn't make any sudden maneuvers. It just slid out.

I was able to steer into it and slowed down and put it in 4WD. I had 2 4runners and a Tacoma before and never lost control like that, even in 2WD.

Say what you want, but anyone serious about being safe in the snow should be on 3PMSF tires or dedicated snow tires.

 

I wonder why the Dunlops have a 2.8 out of 10 for "Would buy again"?
I had the Dunlops on my TRD ORP after sliding down my driveway after a light dusting of snow only for as long as it took to receive a set of Blizzaks from Tire Rack.
Tires are cheap insurance against bent metal, so buy the best you can afford for the conditions you drive in.
Here in MN, I swap tires and wheels twice per year - dedicated winter tires go on when the temps have dropped to consistently 45 degrees.
In the spring, I leave the winter tires on until there is no chance of additional snow.
It maybe takes an hour using a floor jack, one corner at a time, rotating the tires and checking the brakes and suspension, then recoding the ECU with the new TPMS IDs.

 

Well said!

Mine made it to 1300 miles, which took about 2-3 weeks. In 4WD they were OK, but I just didn't trust them. I would have kept them for summer duty, but they're obviously not designed for any sort of off-roading.

Eventually, I want to run hakkapeliittas for the winter and swap in MT's in the summer. The KO2's are a very good do it all tire in the meantime.

 

Keep in mind; that the winter tire compound is very soft. Taking them on & off a wheel can damage them. It is better to buy a cheap set of wheels & TPMS sensors & have two full sets. It keeps your summer wheels in perfect condition & if you bend a cheap wheel...
I was told this by an old friend who was a mechanic for a living. He had no horse in the race.
My $0.02

 

On the subject of chains, they are an amazing piece of equipment for deep snow. I used to drive a propane delivery truck in college and had to chain up about a dozen times a day to get back into cabins in Idaho where I had no business taking a vehicle that large.

That said, I hate them. I don't have a set for my vehicle. If a tightener comes off or a link breaks, it is instant hundreds of dollars of damage to your fender. No thanks.

On the Dunlops, they suck. Sure, some folks think they are just fine. Some folks Jeeps are reliable vehicles, too. Can't talk sense into them no matter what so don't even bother. I ran mine for a month or so and nearly got stuck in my gravel driveway. Took them off and you could see the cords through the tread, the rubber was so thin. Absolute garbage tires.

 

LOL

 

I remember the Firestone VS Ford situation about 20 years ago. Tires spontaneously blowing out. I don't recall who ended taking the blame on that one.

 

The funny thing is that so called "hyper-milers" will run their tires at full pressure to save probably $3 on fuel annually. Imagine how much they're throwing away by causing their tires to wear improperly. Not to mention that they are sacrificing traction by reducing the amount of rubber on the ground. They're not as smart as they think they are.

I don't think the problems with the Dunlops are due to a bad batch. They just don't have a good tread pattern for snow. The user reviews clearly show that they're not good tires.

 

Oh, yeah. That sounds pretty extreme. I'd imagine there would have been a recall if that was a regular occurrence.

You might just be a more conservative driver than most.

I have a similar situation where a handful of people have said that KO2's are junk in rain, but I've had no issues.

It's probably something to do with driving habits. Or, I might just be spoiled by always buying 3PMSF tires for my trucks.

 

Yes, they are. I notice that traffic is a lot less stressful when you look ahead and slow down rather than slamming on the brakes last minute.

I meant conservative in a good way, similar to what you describe.

 

Drivers that are distracted are obvious, as are drivers that look only about 20-30 feet in front of their vehicle are.
If you watch 3 to 6 vehicles in front of you, depending on how close together they are, you should rarely need to use your brakes as @Thatbassguy observes.

Drivers with more confidence than ability are equally obvious, as are drivers with s****y tires for the present conditions.
I am a retired instructor of street survival style driving clinics (summer and winter) and what is currently taught in drivers ed is all over the board but mostly inaccurate and bad advice where I have experience.

Examples:
If you can see the side of your vehicle from your outside mirrors from your driving position, they are incorrectly adjusted - if adjusted correctly you have no blind spots.
If your wrists don't naturally break on top of the steering wheel in your driving position then your seat and/or steering wheel are incorrectly adjusted.
If you are not holding your steering wheel at 9&3 or 10&2, you have less control over your vehicle. Period. We've had students tell us that their drivers ed instructors told them to hold the wheel at 7&5 so when they get in an accident they're less likely to break their arms/wrists from the air bag going off. My response was always, if they held the steering wheel properly to begin with they wouldn't likely have been in that accident in the first place.
I could go on, but I'll stop there.

 

Unfortunately in some cases, here in California, CHP will check to see if you are carrying them in order to let you through chain control. That said, I am having difficult time finding any recommendations to brand/style.

 

Call these people and ask them. Last time I called them they were very helpful. https://www.tirechain.com

 

So are chains not necessarily needed when 4WD is on? If I'm running on 2WD should the chains be on the front or rear tires?

 

Where are you located?

Chains are illegal in many places. Check your local laws.

In my experience, in 4wd with snow rated all terrains, the 4runner feels unstoppable. With dedicated snow tires, aside from a snow deep enough to high center the truck, I think it would be.

That said, what are the conditions you're going to be attempting to drive in?

 

In California near San Francisco. Going to go to Twain Harte which is a city near Yosemite National Park in early February. Currently just bought Bridgestone Dueler H/L Alena Plus tires which are supposed to be good for all weathers. I don't expect much snow but want to come prepared just in case

 

I can't tell you if chains are required, or even legal there.

Are the Duelers 3 peak snow rated? I don't know anything about them.

If you're going to be on highways and paved roads, i would expect you to have no problems with good all seasons and 4wd.

However, if you plan on doing a lot of driving in deep snow, I'd recommend dedicated snow tire , or at least an all terrain with a 3PMSF rating

 

Yes mainly highway and paved roads. So it sounds like I should be alright in 4wd with these after reading several comments online about these tires. Thanks for the help

 

They appear to have a decent amount of siping, which is important for snow traction. At a glance, they look like they would be decent in snow, but not exceptional. The customer ratings are good for snow, though.

Have fun on your road trip, and post pictures!

 

The chains genuinely should go on the back whether you have a 4wd or 2wd

 

I think of chains as being more for keeping you from sliding off a mountain road and tumbling 2000 feet into a canyon— As opposed to “getting through snow”. The 4runner is great in snow. No chains needed, unless you’re in the predicament I described.

 

This applies to RWD correct? I assume you would want them on the drive axle (I know 2wd in a 4runner is rwd); I am asking a different question.
I have plowed snow for over 20 yrs & never carried or used chains (all concrete). That said, I have made some driver errors that caused me to get stuck (driving into a 15 ft snow berm I built & letting the front & rear axles get snow under then.) Just grabbed the shovels & dug ourselves out! Rookie move years ago...

 

A lot of California highways require chains when there is snow. You don't always have to put them on, but CHP can require that you carry them and will have checkpoints to make sure you do. If you don't have chains with you, they will turn you around.

Check to see if the area you're going to requires chains during snow conditions.

 

This is confusing to me. I would think you would want them at all 4 corners like snow tires, whether RWD, FWD, or 4WD.

 

My $.02 Chains on rear wheel drive in questionable conditions (maybe you have no choice at the time). For 4 wheel drive if it is bad enough that that chains are needed maybe you went too far. Again, maybe you had no choice in the matter. Chains are an absolute pain to put on and take off, but like a winch they can help get you out of a jam. However.... if you have chained up and your winch line is out and you are still stuck; you might need some help

 

Winter tires will perform better on ice than all season tires. Much much better. I’m sure everyone’s subjective experiences are valid, but basically any genuine winter tire will significantly out perform an all season or mud tire in winter conditions. I live in a snow belt and use blizzaks in the winter and KO2s in the summer. I wouldn’t attempt winter conditions in Canada where I live without a winter tire. Life is short, and a brief loss of traction at a critical moment could make it shorter. Winter tires are a small price to pay for increased safety.

 

Yeah I guess I was wrong. I was just thinking I would want it on the back even if I had a 4wd due to it being the main drive axle and would prob just have one set. Unless I lived somewhere where 2 sets was necessary. But I probably wouldn't want to live there anyways, ha!

http://www.rubicon-trail.com/jeep101/chains.html

 

Some people think that because they have 4 wheel drive they can haul ass, slow down folks it can be hard to stop.

 

Take a trip West from Denver on I-70 and hang on to your A$$$ when your doors get blown off as you try to maintain your lane with idiots all around you thinking they can go the speed limit and stop on a dime. They forget about that inertia thing.

 

Been there, done that, i lived in Colo. for 11 yrs.